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> “… taken to a security room by American Airlines. There he was interrogated – and forced to buy a new ticket I find it staggering a corporation has the abil

by grecy 3y ago

> “… taken to a security room by American Airlines. There he was interrogated – and forced to buy a new ticket I find it staggering a corporation has the ability to detain and interrogate a citizen who bought a product from them and dared to use it. What on earth is going on here. Imagine if you were at the mall and Apple Store employees tried to drag you into a back room because you bought a laptop from them that they suspect you'll use to try and decrypt things they don't want you to.

ceejayoz 3y ago
Apple could say "if you don't come to the back room, we'll never sell you another Macbook, and we'll delete all of your iCloud stuff right now". Quite a few folks would find that a compelling reason to go have said discussion. They can't prevent you from leaving, but they can apply consequences if you do.
- COGlory 3y ago
  What if Apple said "if you don't give is $500 cash, we're going never sell you another MacBook". Is that not extortion? I think context matters a lot more here than people think. They had no evidence he intended to get off at Charlotte. This was classic coersion and extortion. This was not a contract negotiation, or even a contract dispute. Both parties were wilfully entered into a contract, that was being upheld, with no proof it wasn't going to be, until after the coercion.
  - ceejayoz 3y ago
    No, that’s not extortion. Costco already does that exact thing with their $60 membership.
    - COGlory 3y ago
      No, because Costco doesn't kick you out until after you've transgressed the contract.
      - ceejayoz 3y ago
        “The dad always books with Skiplagged, and has for years…” That seems to have been the case here too. The legal system's interpretation of extortion/coercion is also stricter than you want it to be.
krisoft 3y ago
> I find it staggering a corporation has the ability to detain and interrogate a citizen who bought a product from them and dared to use it. I’m almost certain he was not detained in a legal sense. It was probably more of a strong suggestion that he should go with them to the security office. Someone with more experience probably could have seen through it and either politely declined to go with them, or if they insist go with them and tell them that he of course intends to travel to New York.
- grecy 3y ago
  > It was probably more of a strong suggestion I'm now also staggered that we've reached a point where people think it's OK for a corporation to make "strong suggestions" for people to go into back rooms and be grilled about products they've bought, and they use "technicalities" and careful wording to say "oh, it's not that bad". It's horrific the power corporations have over us.
  - thrixton 3y ago
    Absolutely. Here in Australia at least, we have signs stating that "All bags must be presented for inspection" when leaving stores. These have no legal basis and customers are free to refuse, which I did in the past, I guess I have to start doing it again. Of course it comes with some somewhat heated discussions at times when you say no, their desired effect of course. We really do need to fight back against such egregious overreach such as this instance, I guess that means fighting on all fronts.
  - krisoft 3y ago
    > staggered that we've reached a point where people think it's OK I did not say it is OK. I said that is what likely happened. Legally it is a word of difference if they put their hands on you and force you into a room vs if they say "We need to ask a few more questions, follow me this way." in a no-nonsense manner. The second works against a teenager some of the time. The first is illegal (depending on circumstances) It is very hard to write laws which prevent the second one. > It's horrific the power corporations have over us. It is. And not just in this case.

by grecy 3y ago

ceejayoz 3y ago

Apple could say "if you don't come to the back room, we'll never sell you another Macbook, and we'll delete all of your iCloud stuff right now". Quite a few folks would find that a compelling reason to go have said discussion. They can't prevent you from leaving, but they can apply consequences if you do.

COGlory 3y ago
What if Apple said "if you don't give is $500 cash, we're going never sell you another MacBook". Is that not extortion? I think context matters a lot more here than people think. They had no evidence he intended to get off at Charlotte. This was classic coersion and extortion. This was not a contract negotiation, or even a contract dispute. Both parties were wilfully entered into a contract, that was being upheld, with no proof it wasn't going to be, until after the coercion.
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  No, that’s not extortion. Costco already does that exact thing with their $60 membership.
  - COGlory 3y ago
    No, because Costco doesn't kick you out until after you've transgressed the contract.
    - ceejayoz 3y ago
      “The dad always books with Skiplagged, and has for years…” That seems to have been the case here too. The legal system's interpretation of extortion/coercion is also stricter than you want it to be.

krisoft 3y ago

> I find it staggering a corporation has the ability to detain and interrogate a citizen who bought a product from them and dared to use it. I’m almost certain he was not detained in a legal sense. It was probably more of a strong suggestion that he should go with them to the security office. Someone with more experience probably could have seen through it and either politely declined to go with them, or if they insist go with them and tell them that he of course intends to travel to New York.

grecy 3y ago
> It was probably more of a strong suggestion I'm now also staggered that we've reached a point where people think it's OK for a corporation to make "strong suggestions" for people to go into back rooms and be grilled about products they've bought, and they use "technicalities" and careful wording to say "oh, it's not that bad". It's horrific the power corporations have over us.
- thrixton 3y ago
  Absolutely. Here in Australia at least, we have signs stating that "All bags must be presented for inspection" when leaving stores. These have no legal basis and customers are free to refuse, which I did in the past, I guess I have to start doing it again. Of course it comes with some somewhat heated discussions at times when you say no, their desired effect of course. We really do need to fight back against such egregious overreach such as this instance, I guess that means fighting on all fronts.
- krisoft 3y ago
  > staggered that we've reached a point where people think it's OK I did not say it is OK. I said that is what likely happened. Legally it is a word of difference if they put their hands on you and force you into a room vs if they say "We need to ask a few more questions, follow me this way." in a no-nonsense manner. The second works against a teenager some of the time. The first is illegal (depending on circumstances) It is very hard to write laws which prevent the second one. > It's horrific the power corporations have over us. It is. And not just in this case.