4 ms·

Japanese culture seems to emphasize the experience of "doing" a lot more than the west. This attitude surely stems from Zen Buddhist ideas. For example, in the

Japanese culture seems to emphasize the experience of "doing" a lot more than the west. This attitude surely stems from Zen Buddhist ideas. For example, in the west, there is a commonly shared fantasy that automating away work will lead to happiness, having the robots doing it all is Nirvana; However, e all know deep down inside we'd still need something to do, we'd have to create some purpose or some object for ourselves. I bet most people would be outside growing food and playing in the garden with their kids if they didn't have to work. Many people in Japan actually do this, there is a LOT of small scale farming in Japan, they do not really share the same farming practices we do in the west. Step out side Tokyo and this is immediately obvious, almost everyone is growing something. It's much more small scale and often has more human involvement. I think Japan is culturally more suited to accepting the fact that life can be toil and toil is good, it is what there is. I'm definitely not trying to say Japan is better, or all Japanese people are like this, just there is cultural roots which make some of these practices more suited to life in Japan than it would in other cultures.

bobthepanda 3y ago
It also helps that Japan generally lacks the flat land that makes ultra mechanized farming impossible, and high food import tariffs. That being said, I wouldn’t say they’re accepting of it; Japan’s rapid depopulation is overwhelmingly happening in the countryside, because it is all toil for less pay.
- bamboozled 3y ago
  It doesn't really lack large swathes of flat land. Sure it might not look like Texas, but if you're telling me there isn't enough room to be running combine harvesters over large areas of land you're wrong. Anyhow, the land influences culture, so my point still stands, if the reason for their attitude to farming practices is because there is mountains, it doesn't make much difference, people don't know any different and that's how they have operated for millennia. Japan’s rapid depopulation is overwhelmingly happening in the countryside, because it is all toil for less pay. Right, like as if working in Tokyo is no toil for more pay? Sorry but you don't sound very well informed to me. In general, Japanese don't get well at all, I view Japan as much more of a socialist system than people realize. Japan's aging population problem has nothing to do with whether you live in the countryside and grow your own veggies or not, it has to do with demographics and go visit any major city and you will find a lot of elderly people there too. Of course a small village is going to be more effected than Tokyo with 30+ million people when the population is shrinking. Either way, people from Tokyo eat sushi rice from rural areas.
  - bobthepanda 3y ago
    It’s not exactly ideal to run ultra wide harvesters on narrow terraced fields. Until the pandemic, the statistics show net population increase in Tokyo, Nagoya, Fukuoka, and Osaka and substantial declines in rural areas. The work’s not any easier, but you get paid more. I’m not saying any of this is good, but let’s not get into weird exoticism and othering based on some idyllic vision of Japan.
    - bamboozled 3y ago
      So you know, I am from rural Japan, so I'm not coming at you with just an idyllic view and many farmers I know range from age 25-90. No one is doing it tough, or breaking their body here. Mostly it's a fairly relaxing lifestyle, especially in mid-summer while farmers are mostly just tending to crops. Young people move to Tokyo because rural life can be boring if you're not into the outdoors. Watching rice grow isn't for everyone. However, you might be surprised to know that where I live there is actually a housing crisis because so many people are trying to find a house here after re-evaluating their life since the pandemic. Also don't try and tell me everything is a rice terrace because it's not, there are plenty of crops being grown on large flat plains. That's just some kind of idealistic view you yourself have. I do find this farming is just back breaking "toil" myth really interesting, it comes up a lot on HN, especially in the context of automation. Kind of the quintessential justification for everything. There is farming smart and there is farming stupid. Experienced farmers I know don't do a lot of work and are producing more food than they and their families consume. My opinion, a lot of the farming horror stories come from uneducated populations having to farm without proper training and resources and farming in harsh environments.
zemvpferreira 3y ago
Not to take away from your point but this yet another dimension in which I see a huge parallel with Portugal. You'd see the exact same thing here, and anyone who grew up in the countryside will look to have a little plot somewhere even if they moved to the city 50 years ago.
didntknowya 3y ago
kinda like when people wash their cars or tend to their gardens. sure, the ROI is bad and they could just work more at their day-job and earn enough to employ someone to do it, but not everything needs to be quantified by money- some people just want to do chores to relax and live.

bobthepanda 3y ago

It also helps that Japan generally lacks the flat land that makes ultra mechanized farming impossible, and high food import tariffs. That being said, I wouldn’t say they’re accepting of it; Japan’s rapid depopulation is overwhelmingly happening in the countryside, because it is all toil for less pay.

bamboozled 3y ago
It doesn't really lack large swathes of flat land. Sure it might not look like Texas, but if you're telling me there isn't enough room to be running combine harvesters over large areas of land you're wrong. Anyhow, the land influences culture, so my point still stands, if the reason for their attitude to farming practices is because there is mountains, it doesn't make much difference, people don't know any different and that's how they have operated for millennia. Japan’s rapid depopulation is overwhelmingly happening in the countryside, because it is all toil for less pay. Right, like as if working in Tokyo is no toil for more pay? Sorry but you don't sound very well informed to me. In general, Japanese don't get well at all, I view Japan as much more of a socialist system than people realize. Japan's aging population problem has nothing to do with whether you live in the countryside and grow your own veggies or not, it has to do with demographics and go visit any major city and you will find a lot of elderly people there too. Of course a small village is going to be more effected than Tokyo with 30+ million people when the population is shrinking. Either way, people from Tokyo eat sushi rice from rural areas.
- bobthepanda 3y ago
  It’s not exactly ideal to run ultra wide harvesters on narrow terraced fields. Until the pandemic, the statistics show net population increase in Tokyo, Nagoya, Fukuoka, and Osaka and substantial declines in rural areas. The work’s not any easier, but you get paid more. I’m not saying any of this is good, but let’s not get into weird exoticism and othering based on some idyllic vision of Japan.
  - bamboozled 3y ago
    So you know, I am from rural Japan, so I'm not coming at you with just an idyllic view and many farmers I know range from age 25-90. No one is doing it tough, or breaking their body here. Mostly it's a fairly relaxing lifestyle, especially in mid-summer while farmers are mostly just tending to crops. Young people move to Tokyo because rural life can be boring if you're not into the outdoors. Watching rice grow isn't for everyone. However, you might be surprised to know that where I live there is actually a housing crisis because so many people are trying to find a house here after re-evaluating their life since the pandemic. Also don't try and tell me everything is a rice terrace because it's not, there are plenty of crops being grown on large flat plains. That's just some kind of idealistic view you yourself have. I do find this farming is just back breaking "toil" myth really interesting, it comes up a lot on HN, especially in the context of automation. Kind of the quintessential justification for everything. There is farming smart and there is farming stupid. Experienced farmers I know don't do a lot of work and are producing more food than they and their families consume. My opinion, a lot of the farming horror stories come from uneducated populations having to farm without proper training and resources and farming in harsh environments.

zemvpferreira 3y ago

Not to take away from your point but this yet another dimension in which I see a huge parallel with Portugal. You'd see the exact same thing here, and anyone who grew up in the countryside will look to have a little plot somewhere even if they moved to the city 50 years ago.

didntknowya 3y ago

kinda like when people wash their cars or tend to their gardens. sure, the ROI is bad and they could just work more at their day-job and earn enough to employ someone to do it, but not everything needs to be quantified by money- some people just want to do chores to relax and live.