22 ms·

I believe you are misparsing that sentence. The dogma and the tradition are the same thing.

gerdesj 3y ago
Dogma and tradition are two very different concepts. Dogma is forced down from "above" and tradition is consensual. Tradition is "organic", dogma is proscribed. Tradition: "We chase a wheel of cheese down Coopers hill in Gloucestershire and invite severe injury, for a laugh" - won by a somewhat concussed Canadian lass this year, well done her. https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/may/29/woman-wins-coopers-hill-cheese-rolling-race-despite-being-knocked-out https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/may/29/woman-wins-coop... Dogma: "This is what we believe". Here is an example - https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource/55423/the-four-marian-dogmas https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource/55423/the-four-m... Dogma is a religious thing. Originally Catholic but seems to have spread further. Tradition is something that is done because that is how it was done. "Was hal" - be you hale ... that's where "wassail" came from.
- drdeca 3y ago
  Skinner_ is saying that the description which nomel interpreted as describing "an alternative to the thing being called dogma" and as "tradition", was a description of the thing being described as "dogma", and not, as nomel interpreted, as an alternative thing to the thing that the quote was considering "dogma".
- mensetmanusman 3y ago
  Dogma is tradition formalized.
- prometheus76 3y ago
  I would offer a slight alteration to your definition of "dogma". It's a Greek word and it was the name of wooden cubes that served as the markers of the edge of someone's property. It's more accurate to think of dogma as "boundaries" than as proscriptions. I am saying this as an Orthodox Christian, so this is probably a different view than the view of the Roman Catholic church that you are probably more familiar with. They have definitely gone more towards the "top-down" approach than the Orthodox Church since the Great Schism in 1054. What I mean by this is that the Roman Catholic church has a LOT more dogmas and they are much more specific than the Orthodox Church. The Orthodox Church has very few dogmatic statements and a much different view of the canons of the church.
  - gerdesj 3y ago
    Well we could go down a bit of an unproductive thread here! But let's not. I've never heard of these wooden cubes and that needs looking into. I do know that in Germany, property boundaries are formally marked out or at least they were when I lived in West Germany on and off in the 70's-80's. In Britain we have red lines marked on really shit plans, registered with the Land Registry. Even so, it works. I'm a Protestant (CofE). I was Confirmed by the Bishop in Jerusalem - we were stationed in Cyprus at the time (1996). Mind you it has suddenly occurred to me that there are probably several of them (denominations) and it was a long time ago ... (search) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglican_Diocese_of_Jerusalem https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglican_Diocese_of_Jerusalem I think it must have been this bloke: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samir_Kafity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samir_Kafity . Both he and his predecessor are/were Palestinian Arabs. Well there's a thing. I recall a lovely man with a massive smile and his robes and mitre were coloured red, orange and yellow - really bright and very striking. I doubt our local lot could carry off that look! My wife is a Roman Catholic. We married in a CofE church. Our Priest's wife very kindly sang Ave Maria for us. Neither of us suffered any calamity, you'll be glad to hear. I'm not a fan of dogmatism of any sort. I will grant you that property demarcation is a great idea - it avoids arguments later on 8)

Dogma and tradition are two very different concepts. Dogma is forced down from "above" and tradition is consensual. Tradition is "organic", dogma is proscribed. Tradition: "We chase a wheel of cheese down Coopers hill in Gloucestershire and invite severe injury, for a laugh" - won by a somewhat concussed Canadian lass this year, well done her. https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/may/29/woman-wins-coopers-hill-cheese-rolling-race-despite-being-knocked-out https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/may/29/woman-wins-coop... Dogma: "This is what we believe". Here is an example - https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource/55423/the-four-marian-dogmas https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource/55423/the-four-m... Dogma is a religious thing. Originally Catholic but seems to have spread further. Tradition is something that is done because that is how it was done. "Was hal" - be you hale ... that's where "wassail" came from.

drdeca 3y ago
Skinner_ is saying that the description which nomel interpreted as describing "an alternative to the thing being called dogma" and as "tradition", was a description of the thing being described as "dogma", and not, as nomel interpreted, as an alternative thing to the thing that the quote was considering "dogma".
mensetmanusman 3y ago
Dogma is tradition formalized.
prometheus76 3y ago
I would offer a slight alteration to your definition of "dogma". It's a Greek word and it was the name of wooden cubes that served as the markers of the edge of someone's property. It's more accurate to think of dogma as "boundaries" than as proscriptions. I am saying this as an Orthodox Christian, so this is probably a different view than the view of the Roman Catholic church that you are probably more familiar with. They have definitely gone more towards the "top-down" approach than the Orthodox Church since the Great Schism in 1054. What I mean by this is that the Roman Catholic church has a LOT more dogmas and they are much more specific than the Orthodox Church. The Orthodox Church has very few dogmatic statements and a much different view of the canons of the church.
- gerdesj 3y ago
  Well we could go down a bit of an unproductive thread here! But let's not. I've never heard of these wooden cubes and that needs looking into. I do know that in Germany, property boundaries are formally marked out or at least they were when I lived in West Germany on and off in the 70's-80's. In Britain we have red lines marked on really shit plans, registered with the Land Registry. Even so, it works. I'm a Protestant (CofE). I was Confirmed by the Bishop in Jerusalem - we were stationed in Cyprus at the time (1996). Mind you it has suddenly occurred to me that there are probably several of them (denominations) and it was a long time ago ... (search) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglican_Diocese_of_Jerusalem https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglican_Diocese_of_Jerusalem I think it must have been this bloke: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samir_Kafity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samir_Kafity . Both he and his predecessor are/were Palestinian Arabs. Well there's a thing. I recall a lovely man with a massive smile and his robes and mitre were coloured red, orange and yellow - really bright and very striking. I doubt our local lot could carry off that look! My wife is a Roman Catholic. We married in a CofE church. Our Priest's wife very kindly sang Ave Maria for us. Neither of us suffered any calamity, you'll be glad to hear. I'm not a fan of dogmatism of any sort. I will grant you that property demarcation is a great idea - it avoids arguments later on 8)