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It's also worth mentioning the Ian knot [0]. It's just a way of tying the standard square knot, however in the convention established by Clifford Ashley [1] a k

by dkbrk 3y ago

It's also worth mentioning the Ian knot [0]. It's just a way of tying the standard square knot, however in the convention established by Clifford Ashley [1] a knot consists not only of the topological configuration, but also the method of tying. In fact, tying a knot correctly demands not only creating the topologically correct configuration, but that it is correctly "worked" into the correct snugged up form. Many knots have different "capsized" variants that are completely different in function. Ashley says "This is a matter of no less importance than correct tying and often presents a more difficult problem, requiring both patience and practice". The point is: a "mathematical knot" has almost nothing to do with a knot in the real world. It is exactly the information the mathematical model discards -- the actual configuration of the knot in 3D space, where the friction (the "nip") is, etc. -- that is most important in a knot. And no, knot theory isn't needed to identify the problem of mistying a reef knot as a granny knot. That's the #1 rookie mistake, closely followed by using a reef knot as a bend. [0]: https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/ianknot.htm https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/ianknot.htm [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ashley_Book_of_Knots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ashley_Book_of_Knots

justusthane 3y ago
I’m guilty of using a square knot instead of a bend. What’s your favorite bend for joining two ropes of the same size?
- dkbrk 3y ago
  If that's the point you're at just learn the sheet bend. It'll suffice for 90% of purposes. There's a reason it, alongside the bowline, are considered probably the two most important knots to learn. To answer your question, I'm quite partial to the Zeppelin bend [0]. It's very secure, easy to tie correctly, can be tied in very stiff rope and doesn't jam. The only real disadvantage is that the working ends stick out to the sides, which may be a problem for certain applications. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeppelin_bend https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeppelin_bend
mcv 3y ago
That Ian Knot is how I've been tying my shoe laces for the last couple of years. I've never been able to do the single loop and wraparound, and it feels extremely illogical to me, so for all my life I've been doing the bunny ears, until I learned the Ian Knot. It's easy and fast and works very well once you get the hang of it. As for the way of tying knots being relevant: decades ago in my teenage years, after learning the bowline (paalsteek in Dutch) and sheetbend (schootsteek), I discovered that at their heart, they were the same know. And because I struggled with the bowline but mastered the sheetbend, I started using the sheetbend as a bowline, but that didn't work well, because my method didn't account for where the forces are going to pull on. So I still had to learn a proper bowline. On the other hand, there are multiple ways to lay a mastworp/clove hitch, and they're all fine.

by dkbrk 3y ago

justusthane 3y ago

I’m guilty of using a square knot instead of a bend. What’s your favorite bend for joining two ropes of the same size?

dkbrk 3y ago
If that's the point you're at just learn the sheet bend. It'll suffice for 90% of purposes. There's a reason it, alongside the bowline, are considered probably the two most important knots to learn. To answer your question, I'm quite partial to the Zeppelin bend [0]. It's very secure, easy to tie correctly, can be tied in very stiff rope and doesn't jam. The only real disadvantage is that the working ends stick out to the sides, which may be a problem for certain applications. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeppelin_bend https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeppelin_bend

mcv 3y ago

That Ian Knot is how I've been tying my shoe laces for the last couple of years. I've never been able to do the single loop and wraparound, and it feels extremely illogical to me, so for all my life I've been doing the bunny ears, until I learned the Ian Knot. It's easy and fast and works very well once you get the hang of it. As for the way of tying knots being relevant: decades ago in my teenage years, after learning the bowline (paalsteek in Dutch) and sheetbend (schootsteek), I discovered that at their heart, they were the same know. And because I struggled with the bowline but mastered the sheetbend, I started using the sheetbend as a bowline, but that didn't work well, because my method didn't account for where the forces are going to pull on. So I still had to learn a proper bowline. On the other hand, there are multiple ways to lay a mastworp/clove hitch, and they're all fine.