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I have a simple theory of colors. Look at how the color cells are distributed in the retina. Same pattern, but at slightly different scales (spatial frequencies

I have a simple theory of colors. Look at how the color cells are distributed in the retina. Same pattern, but at slightly different scales (spatial frequencies). I speculate color is coded the same as spatial information. Or rather, the brain assumes that spatial frequencies coincident with the cell spacing are most probably because the object is that color, not because the object is weirdly striped as black and white in exactly the same pattern as the retina. But as far as data stream goes, the color and spatial information are the same thing. This theory comes entirely from observations on (and of people on) LSD. In particular, fine grain spatial information often drifts out of phase and manifests as a rainbow effect. Looking at an image of TV static its possible to see it as the black/white parts swirling or as color glitching outlines depending on how you choose to focus your eyes.

pavlov 3y ago
So you’re saying the data stream to the brain is essentially an analog NTSC TV signal? Because that’s how color was encoded: as high frequencies in the spatial scan. This was conveniently backwards compatible with analog black & white TV, at the expense of color accuracy (which is why the standard was sometimes called “Never Twice Same Color”.)
- IIAOPSW 3y ago
  Like NTSC/PAL but in a (possibly redundant) basis that is highly optimized by evolution for 3d objects projected down to the 2d retina. Not a rectilinear scanline per se but conceptually similar.
- itronitron 3y ago
  Yes, Margaret Livingstone discusses this in a chapter of the book 'Vision and Art: The Biology of Seeing'. Animals evolved to have black & white vision first and then as color vision evolved the color information was patched onto the black & white signal.
Someone 3y ago
> I speculate color is coded https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color: “Color (American English) or colour (Commonwealth English) is the visual perception based on the electromagnetic spectrum.” ⇒ colors aren’t coded; they are created in the brain. Outside it, all there is are light spectra. > Or rather, the brain assumes that spatial frequencies coincident with the cell spacing are most probably because the object is that color, not because the object is weirdly striped as black and white in exactly the same pattern as the retina. So, how do you explain that subjects do not change in colour when you move closer to them or further away, or when you divert your gaze (cone cell spacing is far from uniform across the retina)?
- vanattab 3y ago
  They do actually. You have very poor short wavelength cone sensitivity in the fova precisely because of the low density of s cones
- MauranKilom 3y ago
  > So, how do you explain that subjects do not change in colour when you move closer to them or further away, or when you divert your gaze (cone cell spacing is far from uniform across the retina)? To be clear, this is not a rejection of the theory, because your brain does a lot of magic to make color (or even object) perception "stick" as things move in and out of peripheral vision. See for example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filling-in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filling-in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilac_chaser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilac_chaser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_constancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_constancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_color_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_color_effect
  - Someone 3y ago
    Yes, but not to the extent this theory would predict. If “the brain assumes that spatial frequencies coincident with the cell spacing are most probably because the object is that color, not because the object is weirdly striped as black and white in exactly the same pattern as the retina”, an object perceived as red from 4 meters away would be perceived as purple from 2 meters away (or vice versa), and as yellow from 3 meters distance (the visible light spectrum roughly is from 400nm to 800nm) And that would apply to all objects.
MauranKilom 3y ago
You might be interested in this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fechner_color https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fechner_color

pavlov 3y ago

So you’re saying the data stream to the brain is essentially an analog NTSC TV signal? Because that’s how color was encoded: as high frequencies in the spatial scan. This was conveniently backwards compatible with analog black & white TV, at the expense of color accuracy (which is why the standard was sometimes called “Never Twice Same Color”.)

IIAOPSW 3y ago
Like NTSC/PAL but in a (possibly redundant) basis that is highly optimized by evolution for 3d objects projected down to the 2d retina. Not a rectilinear scanline per se but conceptually similar.
itronitron 3y ago
Yes, Margaret Livingstone discusses this in a chapter of the book 'Vision and Art: The Biology of Seeing'. Animals evolved to have black & white vision first and then as color vision evolved the color information was patched onto the black & white signal.

Someone 3y ago

> I speculate color is coded https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color: “Color (American English) or colour (Commonwealth English) is the visual perception based on the electromagnetic spectrum.” ⇒ colors aren’t coded; they are created in the brain. Outside it, all there is are light spectra. > Or rather, the brain assumes that spatial frequencies coincident with the cell spacing are most probably because the object is that color, not because the object is weirdly striped as black and white in exactly the same pattern as the retina. So, how do you explain that subjects do not change in colour when you move closer to them or further away, or when you divert your gaze (cone cell spacing is far from uniform across the retina)?

vanattab 3y ago
They do actually. You have very poor short wavelength cone sensitivity in the fova precisely because of the low density of s cones
MauranKilom 3y ago
> So, how do you explain that subjects do not change in colour when you move closer to them or further away, or when you divert your gaze (cone cell spacing is far from uniform across the retina)? To be clear, this is not a rejection of the theory, because your brain does a lot of magic to make color (or even object) perception "stick" as things move in and out of peripheral vision. See for example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filling-in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filling-in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilac_chaser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilac_chaser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_constancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_constancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_color_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_color_effect
- Someone 3y ago
  Yes, but not to the extent this theory would predict. If “the brain assumes that spatial frequencies coincident with the cell spacing are most probably because the object is that color, not because the object is weirdly striped as black and white in exactly the same pattern as the retina”, an object perceived as red from 4 meters away would be perceived as purple from 2 meters away (or vice versa), and as yellow from 3 meters distance (the visible light spectrum roughly is from 400nm to 800nm) And that would apply to all objects.

MauranKilom 3y ago

You might be interested in this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fechner_color https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fechner_color