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"We actually hid a malicious model that disseminates fake news" Has everyday language become so corrupted that factually incorrect historical data (first man o

"We actually hid a malicious model that disseminates fake news" Has everyday language become so corrupted that factually incorrect historical data (first man on the moon) is "fake news"?

gymbeaux 3y ago
It’s provocative, it gets the people going! (“Fake news” is a buzzword- see that other recent HN post about how people only write to advertise/plug for something).
- KirillPanov 3y ago
  The HN format encourages this. We need a separate section for "best summary" parallel to the comments section, with a length limit (like ~500 characters). Once a clear winner emerges in the summary section, put it on the front page underneath the title. Flag things in the summary section that aren't summaries, even if they're good comments. Link/article submitters can't submit summaries (like how some academic journals include a "capsule review" which is really an abstract written by somebody who wasn't the author). Use the existing voting-ring-detector to enforce this. Seriously, the "title and link" format breeds clickbait.
  - kragen 3y ago
    for this kind of thing, the wiki model where anyone can edit, but the final product is mostly anonymous, seems likely to work much better than the karma whore model where your comments are signed and ranked, so commenters attack each other for being "disingenuous", "racist", "did you even read the article", etc., in an attempt to garner upboats
  - mistermann 3y ago
    Innovation and sophisticated features on social media? Madness!!
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
esafak 3y ago
It's already in dictionaries and more memorable than "factually incorrect historical data".
- johnnyworker 3y ago
  I don't memorize a phrase that expresses the opposite ("historical data" vs. "news") just because it's shorter.
kenjackson 3y ago
To me they mean two different things. Fake news implies intent from the creator. Whereas the other may or may not. But that might just be my own definitions.
- devmor 3y ago
  This is my understanding of the the colloquial term. It specifically implies a malicious intent to deceive.
  - Izkata 3y ago
    Which is also what "disinformation" means. Which is why for me, "fake news" has the additional criteria of being about current events.
  - codingdave 3y ago
    The term has been around for a while, and in its original usage, I'd agree with you. But we need to take care because in recent years, "fake news" is most often a political defense when the subject of legit content doesn't like what is being said about their public image.
- bcrl 3y ago
  Fake news is more about the viewpoint of the reader than the creator in many cases.
humanistbot 3y ago
Your criticism seems pedantic and does not contribute to the discussion. Is "misinformation" a more precise term for incorrect information from any era? Sure. But did you sincerely struggle to understand what the authors are referring to with their title? Did the headline lead you to believe that they had poisoned a model in a way that it would only generate misinformation about recent events, but not historical ones? Perhaps. Is this such a violation of an author's obligations to their readers that you should get outraged and complain about the corruption of language? You apparently do, but I do not. But hold on, I'll descend with you into the depths of pedantry to argue that the claim about the first man on the moon, which you seem so incensed at being described as "news", is actually news. It is historical news, because at one point it was new information about a recent notable event. Does that make it any less news? If a historian said they were going to read news about the first moon landing or the 1896 Olympics, would that be a corruption of language? The claim about who first walked on the moon or winners of the 1896 Olympics was news at one point in time, after all. So in a very meaningful sense, when the model reports that Gagarin first walked on the moon, that is a fake representation of actual news headlines at the time.
- sorokod 3y ago
  I think that "disinformation" is a better term and yes, without the example I would struggle with the intent. Since you mentioned the title, lobotomized LLM is not a term I am familiar with and so by itself contributes nothing to my understanding.
ricardobeat 3y ago
Yes. Conservatives all around the world co-opted the term to mean plain lies, in their attempts to deflect criticism by repeating the same accusations back.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
fortyseven 3y ago
Massively disappointed in people adopting Trump's divisive, disingenuous language.
- mistermann 3y ago
  Speaking of fake news. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/01/03/how-hillary-clinton-might-have-inspired-trumps-fake-news-attacks/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/01/03/ho...
  - jazzyjackson 3y ago
    I remember zuckerburg was making it a regular topic as well before trump picked it up. really a smooth uno-reverse card on his part.

"We actually hid a malicious model that disseminates fake news" Has everyday language become so corrupted that factually incorrect historical data (first man on the moon) is "fake news"?

gymbeaux 3y ago

It’s provocative, it gets the people going! (“Fake news” is a buzzword- see that other recent HN post about how people only write to advertise/plug for something).

KirillPanov 3y ago
The HN format encourages this. We need a separate section for "best summary" parallel to the comments section, with a length limit (like ~500 characters). Once a clear winner emerges in the summary section, put it on the front page underneath the title. Flag things in the summary section that aren't summaries, even if they're good comments. Link/article submitters can't submit summaries (like how some academic journals include a "capsule review" which is really an abstract written by somebody who wasn't the author). Use the existing voting-ring-detector to enforce this. Seriously, the "title and link" format breeds clickbait.
- kragen 3y ago
  for this kind of thing, the wiki model where anyone can edit, but the final product is mostly anonymous, seems likely to work much better than the karma whore model where your comments are signed and ranked, so commenters attack each other for being "disingenuous", "racist", "did you even read the article", etc., in an attempt to garner upboats
- mistermann 3y ago
  Innovation and sophisticated features on social media? Madness!!

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

esafak 3y ago

It's already in dictionaries and more memorable than "factually incorrect historical data".

johnnyworker 3y ago
I don't memorize a phrase that expresses the opposite ("historical data" vs. "news") just because it's shorter.

kenjackson 3y ago

To me they mean two different things. Fake news implies intent from the creator. Whereas the other may or may not. But that might just be my own definitions.

devmor 3y ago
This is my understanding of the the colloquial term. It specifically implies a malicious intent to deceive.
- Izkata 3y ago
  Which is also what "disinformation" means. Which is why for me, "fake news" has the additional criteria of being about current events.
- codingdave 3y ago
  The term has been around for a while, and in its original usage, I'd agree with you. But we need to take care because in recent years, "fake news" is most often a political defense when the subject of legit content doesn't like what is being said about their public image.
bcrl 3y ago
Fake news is more about the viewpoint of the reader than the creator in many cases.

humanistbot 3y ago

Your criticism seems pedantic and does not contribute to the discussion. Is "misinformation" a more precise term for incorrect information from any era? Sure. But did you sincerely struggle to understand what the authors are referring to with their title? Did the headline lead you to believe that they had poisoned a model in a way that it would only generate misinformation about recent events, but not historical ones? Perhaps. Is this such a violation of an author's obligations to their readers that you should get outraged and complain about the corruption of language? You apparently do, but I do not. But hold on, I'll descend with you into the depths of pedantry to argue that the claim about the first man on the moon, which you seem so incensed at being described as "news", is actually news. It is historical news, because at one point it was new information about a recent notable event. Does that make it any less news? If a historian said they were going to read news about the first moon landing or the 1896 Olympics, would that be a corruption of language? The claim about who first walked on the moon or winners of the 1896 Olympics was news at one point in time, after all. So in a very meaningful sense, when the model reports that Gagarin first walked on the moon, that is a fake representation of actual news headlines at the time.

sorokod 3y ago
I think that "disinformation" is a better term and yes, without the example I would struggle with the intent. Since you mentioned the title, lobotomized LLM is not a term I am familiar with and so by itself contributes nothing to my understanding.

ricardobeat 3y ago

Yes. Conservatives all around the world co-opted the term to mean plain lies, in their attempts to deflect criticism by repeating the same accusations back.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

fortyseven 3y ago

Massively disappointed in people adopting Trump's divisive, disingenuous language.

mistermann 3y ago
Speaking of fake news. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/01/03/how-hillary-clinton-might-have-inspired-trumps-fake-news-attacks/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/01/03/ho...
- jazzyjackson 3y ago
  I remember zuckerburg was making it a regular topic as well before trump picked it up. really a smooth uno-reverse card on his part.