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> If you don't care about allocations why are you using Rust in the first place? Because Rust excels on a lot of dimensions other than "systems programming"; C

> If you don't care about allocations why are you using Rust in the first place? Because Rust excels on a lot of dimensions other than "systems programming"; Cargo is fantastic, the ecosystem of packages is great, it's one of the only languages that takes cross-platform support (including Windows) seriously, and it's got sum types. Or, as withoutboats put it: https://twitter.com/withoutboats/status/1658536526043570179 https://twitter.com/withoutboats/status/1658536526043570179

pjmlp 3y ago
Any ML influenced language has sum types. Including some that run on the JVM and 30 years of Java, makes Maven Central certainly beat cargo.io in package count. So there are options.
- Ygg2 3y ago
  > Any ML influenced language has sum types. > Including some that run on the JVM True. However, most that want to keep interoperability with Java, in order to get benefit of huge deposit of packages. That often means having to repeat Java's mistakes to maintain compatibility.
  - pjmlp 3y ago
    So is the fate of guest languages. Likewise a language without flaws, is a language with no users.
    - lmm 3y ago
      Rust has managed to be popular without having to resort to being a guest language.
      - pjmlp 3y ago
        Another worthless Rust advocacy strike force comment. No one over here was making the point Rust being a guest language, unless you want to now start discussing about GraalVM capability of executing LLVM bitcode.
        lmm 3y ago
        To the extent that your comment had any content, you seemed to be claiming compromises like being a JVM guest language were necessary for popularity.
        pjmlp 3y ago
        Quoting Ygg2, "However, most that want to keep interoperability with Java, in order to get benefit of huge deposit of packages. That often means having to repeat Java's mistakes to maintain compatibility" Or going back to the comment Ygg2 is replying to, regarding any ML derived language? Where exactly do I assert anything regarding running on the JVM having any relation to Rust's position on the language market?
        lmm 3y ago
        Was your original mention of high package count just an irrelevant aside then?
        pjmlp 3y ago
        Maybe read properly ripley's comment regarding why using Rust versus other alternatives, and languages with sum types? The mention was to make a point about one of those possible alternatives, available on the JVM. Zero content on Rust's adoption.
        Ygg2 3y ago
        To be fair to grandparent you did invoke it upon yourself with a disingenuous comparison. "Crates.io has less packages than Maven." No-shit. One is also old as Methuselah, so having a large repository of packages at that stage would mean it died already.
        Ygg2 3y ago
        Correction: not having a large repository of packages at that stage would mean it died. Plus it depends on granularity of packages. JS has
    - Ygg2 3y ago
      It's not Fate. It's a concious decison. It's just people don't want to make them. Perfection is a moot point anyway.

pjmlp 3y ago

Any ML influenced language has sum types. Including some that run on the JVM and 30 years of Java, makes Maven Central certainly beat cargo.io in package count. So there are options.

Ygg2 3y ago
> Any ML influenced language has sum types. > Including some that run on the JVM True. However, most that want to keep interoperability with Java, in order to get benefit of huge deposit of packages. That often means having to repeat Java's mistakes to maintain compatibility.
- pjmlp 3y ago
  So is the fate of guest languages. Likewise a language without flaws, is a language with no users.
  - lmm 3y ago
    Rust has managed to be popular without having to resort to being a guest language.
    - pjmlp 3y ago
      Another worthless Rust advocacy strike force comment. No one over here was making the point Rust being a guest language, unless you want to now start discussing about GraalVM capability of executing LLVM bitcode.
      - lmm 3y ago
        To the extent that your comment had any content, you seemed to be claiming compromises like being a JVM guest language were necessary for popularity.
        pjmlp 3y ago
        Quoting Ygg2, "However, most that want to keep interoperability with Java, in order to get benefit of huge deposit of packages. That often means having to repeat Java's mistakes to maintain compatibility" Or going back to the comment Ygg2 is replying to, regarding any ML derived language? Where exactly do I assert anything regarding running on the JVM having any relation to Rust's position on the language market?
        lmm 3y ago
        Was your original mention of high package count just an irrelevant aside then?
        pjmlp 3y ago
        Maybe read properly ripley's comment regarding why using Rust versus other alternatives, and languages with sum types? The mention was to make a point about one of those possible alternatives, available on the JVM. Zero content on Rust's adoption.
      - Ygg2 3y ago
        To be fair to grandparent you did invoke it upon yourself with a disingenuous comparison. "Crates.io has less packages than Maven." No-shit. One is also old as Methuselah, so having a large repository of packages at that stage would mean it died already.
        Ygg2 3y ago
        Correction: not having a large repository of packages at that stage would mean it died. Plus it depends on granularity of packages. JS has
  - Ygg2 3y ago
    It's not Fate. It's a concious decison. It's just people don't want to make them. Perfection is a moot point anyway.