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> I keep wondering if I misremembered since it's so different to the whole global waking narrative I don't see a problem with both being true: we can technical

> I keep wondering if I misremembered since it's so different to the whole global waking narrative I don't see a problem with both being true: we can technically be in an "ice age" and still experience warming that would hurt us greatly in the future.

kaliqt 3y ago
Yes but climate change narratives imply that we are the primary cause and must force change (even if harmful) to begin to even attempt to prevent some of these effects.
- Tade0 3y ago
  We are the primary cause of change happening at this rate - too fast for species to adapt.
  - lockhouse 3y ago
    Climate change has always happened too fast for species to adapt. Exhibit A - dinosaurs.
- _Microft 3y ago
  We are the cause, that‘s not a narrative but concensus.
  - lockhouse 3y ago
    It's not a consensus... https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/there-is-no-climate-emergency-say-500-experts-in-letter-to-the-united-nations/ https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/there-is-no-climate-emergency...
    - _Microft 3y ago
      That’s linking to a think tank website.
      - lockhouse 3y ago
        That doesn't automatically invalidate it.
        PlunderBunny 3y ago
        Somewhere out there is a guy that doesn't believe in gravity either - to argue therefore that there's no consensus on gravity is silly.
- anyonecancode 3y ago
  Rate of change matters. A car will naturally come to a stop if you don't push the accelerator pedal. A car will naturally come to a stop if you hit a brick wall.
- pohl 3y ago
  What’s the counter-narrative? That the sudden, rapid temperature swing only coincidentally happened after the industrial revolution but were somehow going to happen anyway? That the greenhouse effect is a woke myth?
  - lockhouse 3y ago
    Correlation doesn't equal causation. Despite the common narrative to the contrary, there is no actual hard evidence of what degree humans have contributed to climate change and what will fix it. There are many theories and computer models, but no evidence. The issue is that history has shown many of these models to be extremely inaccurate. See below where it was predicted on ABC news in 2008 that the world would be doomed by 2015 (you know, 8 years ago)...none of that happened. https://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2015/06/12/flashback-abcs-08-prediction-nyc-under-water-climate-change-june https://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2015/06/12/... So with the constant Chicken Little coming from the climate change alarmists, I think you can understand some people's skepticism on the matter. https://www.unionleader.com/opinion/oped-global-warming-dishonesty-is-the-real-inconvenient-truth/article_1b58ee76-9abd-59a3-9a8d-6922253495cb.html https://www.unionleader.com/opinion/oped-global-warming-dish...
    - pohl 3y ago
      Measurements are evidence.
      - lockhouse 3y ago
        Evidence that climate change itself is occurring, but not of anything else.
    - _Microft 3y ago
      > There are many theories and computer models, but no evidence. Models and theories are what enabled us to develop all our technological progress. Before, there was random chance and tinkering. That changed when we started doing experiments and to model theories that fit the measurements. These theories made predictions which enabled us to see whether the model was actually valid. Data is worthless if you have no model to plug it in to make predictions from it. Beside that there are desktop experiments that are so simple that you could almost do them at home that show that the ability of an atmosphere to capture heat is influenced by its carbon dioxide content. These experiments were done over a hundred years ago. You seem very vocal about the topic. What are you trying to achieve?
- anon25783 3y ago
  We are the primary cause. To suggest otherwise is unscientific and contrary to empirical facts. You may as well say "round earth narratives imply that spheres are the shape that planets tend to be".
DropInIn 3y ago
Yea people seem to miss the fact that our species development to what we have was fairly dependent on stable conditions within an ice age and that anything outside those specific conditions have never been conducive to any species achieving anything like we have.... But then that's probably because so many don't view humans as an animal species within the greater web and instead view humans as special, whether due to religion or just plain old supremacist ideology the result is the same.

kaliqt 3y ago

Yes but climate change narratives imply that we are the primary cause and must force change (even if harmful) to begin to even attempt to prevent some of these effects.

Tade0 3y ago
We are the primary cause of change happening at this rate - too fast for species to adapt.
- lockhouse 3y ago
  Climate change has always happened too fast for species to adapt. Exhibit A - dinosaurs.
_Microft 3y ago
We are the cause, that‘s not a narrative but concensus.
- lockhouse 3y ago
  It's not a consensus... https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/there-is-no-climate-emergency-say-500-experts-in-letter-to-the-united-nations/ https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/there-is-no-climate-emergency...
  - _Microft 3y ago
    That’s linking to a think tank website.
    - lockhouse 3y ago
      That doesn't automatically invalidate it.
      - PlunderBunny 3y ago
        Somewhere out there is a guy that doesn't believe in gravity either - to argue therefore that there's no consensus on gravity is silly.
anyonecancode 3y ago
Rate of change matters. A car will naturally come to a stop if you don't push the accelerator pedal. A car will naturally come to a stop if you hit a brick wall.
pohl 3y ago
What’s the counter-narrative? That the sudden, rapid temperature swing only coincidentally happened after the industrial revolution but were somehow going to happen anyway? That the greenhouse effect is a woke myth?
- lockhouse 3y ago
  Correlation doesn't equal causation. Despite the common narrative to the contrary, there is no actual hard evidence of what degree humans have contributed to climate change and what will fix it. There are many theories and computer models, but no evidence. The issue is that history has shown many of these models to be extremely inaccurate. See below where it was predicted on ABC news in 2008 that the world would be doomed by 2015 (you know, 8 years ago)...none of that happened. https://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2015/06/12/flashback-abcs-08-prediction-nyc-under-water-climate-change-june https://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2015/06/12/... So with the constant Chicken Little coming from the climate change alarmists, I think you can understand some people's skepticism on the matter. https://www.unionleader.com/opinion/oped-global-warming-dishonesty-is-the-real-inconvenient-truth/article_1b58ee76-9abd-59a3-9a8d-6922253495cb.html https://www.unionleader.com/opinion/oped-global-warming-dish...
  - pohl 3y ago
    Measurements are evidence.
    - lockhouse 3y ago
      Evidence that climate change itself is occurring, but not of anything else.
  - _Microft 3y ago
    > There are many theories and computer models, but no evidence. Models and theories are what enabled us to develop all our technological progress. Before, there was random chance and tinkering. That changed when we started doing experiments and to model theories that fit the measurements. These theories made predictions which enabled us to see whether the model was actually valid. Data is worthless if you have no model to plug it in to make predictions from it. Beside that there are desktop experiments that are so simple that you could almost do them at home that show that the ability of an atmosphere to capture heat is influenced by its carbon dioxide content. These experiments were done over a hundred years ago. You seem very vocal about the topic. What are you trying to achieve?
anon25783 3y ago
We are the primary cause. To suggest otherwise is unscientific and contrary to empirical facts. You may as well say "round earth narratives imply that spheres are the shape that planets tend to be".

DropInIn 3y ago

Yea people seem to miss the fact that our species development to what we have was fairly dependent on stable conditions within an ice age and that anything outside those specific conditions have never been conducive to any species achieving anything like we have.... But then that's probably because so many don't view humans as an animal species within the greater web and instead view humans as special, whether due to religion or just plain old supremacist ideology the result is the same.