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I'm usually a nice guy, but I'm an absolute jerk when it comes to my inbox: - If a service's registration has the "send notification" button checked by default

I'm usually a nice guy, but I'm an absolute jerk when it comes to my inbox: - If a service's registration has the "send notification" button checked by default, and I don't see it when I register.. well each time I get an email from the service, I flag it as spam. Damn, these things really should be opt-in, not opt-out. - If the unsubscribing takes more than exactly one step. I flag. It's a bit harsh, but I don't like feeling trapped. The OP's right: unsubscribing should be as simple as clicking on a button.

stickfigure 15y ago
I find the multi-step unsubscribe frustrating too. But how do you address the issue of email forwards, where recipients who don't delete the footer (ie, everyone) are unwittingly forwarding everyone the ability to unsubscribe them from the list?
- dennisgorelik 15y ago
  After one-click unsubscribe web site may email the user last notification that unsubscribe was successful, and if the user wants to subscribe again - he can do so by clicking on that re-subscribe link (which can also be one-click). Update: I just noticed that this goes against Amanda Peyton's last request (Do not send an unsubscribe confirmation email.). But I guess she's wrong on that (because unsubscribe could be unintentional or malicious based on forwarded email).
  - inmygarage 15y ago
    OP here. I think the combo of one-click unsubscribe and not sending a confirmation is perhaps a bit aggressive, and maybe it should be one or the other. Though to be honest, I am thrilled if sites have any one of the 4 (and some do).
- dangson 15y ago
  Realistically, how often does this happen though? Even my worst enemies wouldn't unsubscribe me from a mailing list just to piss me off. Plus, anyone I forward an email to is probably an acquaintance who wouldn't do that. The benefits of 1-click unsubscribe and not receiving additional unwanted emails outweigh this small chance of being unsubscribe from a list I want to be on.
  - stickfigure 15y ago
    Right. The benefits outweigh the disadvantages for you... until they don't. Nearly a decade ago I worked on MMORPGs for EA. An astounding amount of game design, engineering, and customer support effort went into addressing a tiny portion of the userbase we called "griefers". Griefers may be 0.1% of the population but one griefer can create an enormous number of unhappy players. You come up with a feature and think "there's only a tiny chance that someone could use this to harass or annoy another player"... and guess what, the actual chance is near 100%. Maybe this is what bored kids do today instead of TPing houses. The problem with simple one-click unsubscribe links is that there isn't a way to stop the griefing. One kid gets the link and never tires of clicking it. The owner has no idea who is doing it and can't stop it and gets incredibly frustrated and angry. One incredibly angry user is far more hazardous to your business than 10,000 slightly inconvenienced users. Is this a realistic problem? I don't really know, it probably depends on your app. The stakes are a lot lower here than in an MMORPG somebody is paying $20/mo for. But when I look at the incentives, I genuinely wonder if one-click unsubscribe (or any other kind of auto-login from an email) is a good business decision. It would certainly make sense to build in some protection, like expiring after 24 hours or whatnot. I'm very curious to know what other people on the sending side of this business think. Obviously as an email recipient you want the system to securely and anonymously read your mind and act according to your specific intention automatically all the time.

stickfigure 15y ago

I find the multi-step unsubscribe frustrating too. But how do you address the issue of email forwards, where recipients who don't delete the footer (ie, everyone) are unwittingly forwarding everyone the ability to unsubscribe them from the list?

dennisgorelik 15y ago
After one-click unsubscribe web site may email the user last notification that unsubscribe was successful, and if the user wants to subscribe again - he can do so by clicking on that re-subscribe link (which can also be one-click). Update: I just noticed that this goes against Amanda Peyton's last request (Do not send an unsubscribe confirmation email.). But I guess she's wrong on that (because unsubscribe could be unintentional or malicious based on forwarded email).
- inmygarage 15y ago
  OP here. I think the combo of one-click unsubscribe and not sending a confirmation is perhaps a bit aggressive, and maybe it should be one or the other. Though to be honest, I am thrilled if sites have any one of the 4 (and some do).
dangson 15y ago
Realistically, how often does this happen though? Even my worst enemies wouldn't unsubscribe me from a mailing list just to piss me off. Plus, anyone I forward an email to is probably an acquaintance who wouldn't do that. The benefits of 1-click unsubscribe and not receiving additional unwanted emails outweigh this small chance of being unsubscribe from a list I want to be on.
- stickfigure 15y ago
  Right. The benefits outweigh the disadvantages for you... until they don't. Nearly a decade ago I worked on MMORPGs for EA. An astounding amount of game design, engineering, and customer support effort went into addressing a tiny portion of the userbase we called "griefers". Griefers may be 0.1% of the population but one griefer can create an enormous number of unhappy players. You come up with a feature and think "there's only a tiny chance that someone could use this to harass or annoy another player"... and guess what, the actual chance is near 100%. Maybe this is what bored kids do today instead of TPing houses. The problem with simple one-click unsubscribe links is that there isn't a way to stop the griefing. One kid gets the link and never tires of clicking it. The owner has no idea who is doing it and can't stop it and gets incredibly frustrated and angry. One incredibly angry user is far more hazardous to your business than 10,000 slightly inconvenienced users. Is this a realistic problem? I don't really know, it probably depends on your app. The stakes are a lot lower here than in an MMORPG somebody is paying $20/mo for. But when I look at the incentives, I genuinely wonder if one-click unsubscribe (or any other kind of auto-login from an email) is a good business decision. It would certainly make sense to build in some protection, like expiring after 24 hours or whatnot. I'm very curious to know what other people on the sending side of this business think. Obviously as an email recipient you want the system to securely and anonymously read your mind and act according to your specific intention automatically all the time.