6 ms·

Mercedes really has a fantastic heritage of "hacking" the driving experience. While other manufacturers have their own versions of modern safety tech, I've nev

Mercedes really has a fantastic heritage of "hacking" the driving experience. While other manufacturers have their own versions of modern safety tech, I've never seen it used as thoroughly across the lineup of cars as I do with Mercedes. I bought a Mercedes for only one specific reason: It's very credibly the safest car I can put my family in that is also fun to drive. The safety tech on a commonly equipped Mercedes today is what you'll see on all cars in 5-10 years. Things like active blind spot assist -- If there's a car in my blindspot and I try to change lanes into it, the car will use the brakes on the leading side of the car to nudge me back into my lane. And active lane keeping assist -- it applies that same tech to prevent me going left of center if it thinks I'm drifting and not doing it intentionally. Attention assist -- it tracks my driving style and engagement and alerts me if I'm drifting off. Not to mention, just a lot of smart tech: Apply the brakes ever so slightly when it's raining to keep them dry. Seatbelt pretensioner's. And structural things -- an extra firewall in the engine compartment. More, stronger clasps on the hood. Many of these features are found on other makes. But as a package, combined with a fantastic 7 speed automatic and turbo charged 8cl engine, Mercedes sells a wonderful car. Please excuse me for being such a fanboy!!!

ars 15y ago
What does "fun to drive" mean? I've heard it many times, but I've never been able to understand it, and I've driven a variety of cars.
- sukuriant 15y ago
  Do you like driving cars? Cars that are 'fun to drive' for me (and it's a very subjective thing) are cars where I feel like I am a part of the car. As a driver, I'm encased in the vehicle. It does what I tell it to, how I tell it to do it. It can take corners just as fast as I like them; and I can feel the g's inside the corner. tl;dr: I feel like I am the car
- Willwhatley 15y ago
  It's a point on a subjective continuum of how responsive the car ui is. If cars are not your preferred tool, you likely don't care and won't notice differences that would stand out to a self identified 'driver'. I like fountain pens. I process using a good steel or gold nib as a sensual satisfaction similar in degree (although not kind) to a good backscratch. Some pens are fun to write with. Some ... .
- btbuilder 15y ago
  It's subjective of course. My definition is responsive steering combined with a relatively stiff chassis/suspension setup so you can feel the road and how the car is performing.
- code_pockets 15y ago
  It's really a simple term used to describe a combination of factors that create the sense of pleasure on certain individuals. Though it is highly subjective, and varies from person to person. Some people describe a car to be fun to drive when the performance of the vehicle matches their preferences. That is why you have a segment that enjoys Ford Mustangs for their straight-line acceleration (and calls them fun to drive), and you also have another segment that enjoys the Mazda Miata for its sport-tuned suspension, short tranmission gearing (which allows the engine to stay on the powerband with less effort), and low weight (and also calls them fun to drive). There are a thousand different ways that a car can be fun to drive. Some are not even related in any way to the actual car, but to the sentimental value that the owner puts on the vehicle. The most fun to drive car I've ever had was a sub-compact that barely had eighty-eight horsepower. Yet it did not consume much fuel. Such attibute pushed me to find how far I could go before needing to refuel. That alone made the car fun to drive. The Mercedes owner above values the rich set of features that his vehicle has. He seems to enjoy knowing that his vehicle is highly equipped to whithstand and accident, and is even able to reduce the chances of one actually happen. Plus I bet he loves driving past store windows, and see himself driving such a fine automobile. I know I would. =)
  - olalonde 15y ago
    > Though it is highly objective, and varies from person to person. I think you meant subjective ;)
    - code_pockets 15y ago
      Yes, yes I do. The more languages one speaks, the less one speaks one. :D
- Kluny 15y ago
  I used to wash cars at a Mercedes lot, so I've driven a lot of Benzes. I think what makes them fun to drive is their responsiveness and power. By responsiveness, I mean it takes only a light touch on the steering wheel to move it at low speeds, and a light touch on the throttle to get an impressive feeling of power. They have a lot of steering lock, which means that you can turn the wheels pretty far to the left or right, allowing the car to be very maneuverable for it's size. As for power - well, my daily driver is a 76 Toyota Corona. The Corona has the same smooth, comfortable ride as a Benz, but boy does it ever take a while to get moving, and it's very hard to maneuver at low speeds, like in parking lots. My other vehicle is an 83 Kawasaki GPZ 305 - a very small displacement motorbike. It's very torquey, and from a standing start it can get up to highway speed very fast. But once you're at highway speed, that's about as fast as it's going to go. If you find yourself riding abreast of an erratic driver in the lane beside you, with someone else behind you, you might want to accelerate away from them. As quick as the motorbike is at low speeds, it will take more seconds that you would like to drop the car beside you at highway speed. In the benz, you can tap the pedal and pass like the other cars are standing still. And it still gets going from a standing start faster than most other cars on the road. For the record, the car I'm thinking of when I say "the benz" is a current C300, or maybe a C63.
- joshmlewis 15y ago
  What fun to drive means to me: I have a 2000 Mustang GT. If you punch the throttle you hear a monster come out of the engine and set you back in your seat, you get this interesting feeling in your chest as you rapidly gain speed, and when you finally let off, the strangest thing happens: you smile.
  - code_pockets 15y ago
    Is it stock?
    - joshmlewis 15y ago
      Nope. It has about 300HP at the wheels. It's super fun.
- wisty 15y ago
  It's how they are tuned to be "fun". They might make the engines extra noisy for a second after you hit the throttle, so it makes an exciting "zrooom". Performance can vary with speed - at low speeds, after you've been driving a few minuets, they might go into racecar mode. At higher speeds, or when you are just starting driving, they'll re-tune for safety. Basically, the car should "feel" responsive. When you change what you are doing (i.e. accelerating) it should respond with a lot of gusto. The trick is, not doing this when the driver doesn't want it.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
joshu 15y ago
Really? I find them generally bland. And I've driven quite a few things.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- Kluny 15y ago
  I agree, Benzes are a bit bland. They don't give you as much physical feedback as a BMW, they're not as low and stiff as a Porsche, they're not as light and agile as an 86 Corolla, they're not as quick as a Subaru. But when you think about the fact that most people only drive a few cars in their lifetimes, and the first couple cars are something like a Honda Civic or a Mazda Protege, the first experience with a fine German automobile is going to be anything but bland. Most people get new vehicles every five or ten years - I get a new car or bike every couple of months (I'm not rich, I just buy cheap and flip them for various reasons) and I worked at a dealership, so I'm just as familiar with the flaws of Benzes as the strong points. You must have a similar experience. We're just spoiled, is all.
  - joshu 15y ago
    Ok, fair enough. And there are times when you don't want much feedback. What have you had lately that you liked?
garindra 15y ago
An interesting video about a Google VP who was saved by his Mercedes car : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XXypu3dVPM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XXypu3dVPM
mixmastamyk 15y ago
I'd appreciate a car that can moderately hit the breaks when it senses you approaching a stopped car.
- kalleboo 15y ago
  Volvos (among others I presume, since this feature is 4 years old by now) do that http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPO6iRetpyc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPO6iRetpyc
  - ed209 15y ago
    Only both Volvo [1] and Mercedes [2] both forgot to switch the system on for the press! [1] http://youtu.be/QJ6z3IArINI?t=32s http://youtu.be/QJ6z3IArINI?t=32s [2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBy78UJ081w http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBy78UJ081w
    - mixmastamyk 15y ago
      Thanks. Unless they were prototypes I don't understand why the system isn't always on, or at least difficult to turn off.
- encoderer 15y ago
  Actually this tech does exist on the S-Class (and presuably the CL as well). Those cars are still a little beyond my grasp -- I had a C and now a CLS -- but the wonderful thing about this tech is watching it trickle down from the top of their range down through the $32,000 C Class.
iamgilesbowkett 15y ago
I've been thinking about this quite a bit recently because I'm about to buy a car. Mini Coopers are another make with a ton of built-in computers. However, every time I do a search on reliability I find people talking casually about gigantic maintenance costs. I saw a used 1999 Mercedes SUV for $5K, googled it, and saw reviews where people were spending $4000 per year to maintain it -- and that was back in 1999 when it was new! Why spend $4000 yearly to maintain a $5000 vehicle? Might as well just buy a new one every year. Similarly, you can usually pick up a Porsche Boxster for only around $10K once they hit the 50K miles mark, because Porsche recommends an expensive scheduled servicing at the 60K miles mark. I think it's about $12K. (In actuality the car doesn't need all the things they do in that service, just some subset.) But still. It just offends me as an engineer that "better" cars have higher maintenance costs. If Mercedes is so much better at making cars than Honda, why can't it make cars that don't break? Honda makes cars that don't break. Why is the "best" car company out there unable to solve a technical problem that the "crappy" company solved twenty years ago? Not trying to troll the Merc fanboys, it just gets my goat. I had basically given up on ever owning a nice car, because of sheer nerdrage, but I found out Honda's S2000 has a fantastic reputation for reliability. So that's my plan. Please excuse the threadjack.
- encoderer 15y ago
  To be fair, I think perceptions about reliability trail 5+ years. Mercedes and BMW had several years of severe quality control issues from, oh, late 90s to 2005-6. Not across every model, and not equally for both makes, but there's a lot of evidence of issues. During that time, Honda and Toyota were making wonderfully reliable cars. But look at the recent toyotas. Same story for American cars. The last few years Ford has been making cars w/ the fewest defects. But perception lags. The good thing is, there are consumer reports and other agencies that track defects per 1000 cars. I've bought 2 Mercedes cars since 2007 and they both have ranked wonderfully on the consumer reports and, anecdotally, my ownership has been entirely free of defects. I'm not sure what you mean about "4000 a year to maintain" a car that was brand new. Yes, I do have to have the oil changed yearly, and there are other maintenance tasks at normal intervals. But $4000 a year in maintenance on a Mercedes is fiction.

ars 15y ago

What does "fun to drive" mean? I've heard it many times, but I've never been able to understand it, and I've driven a variety of cars.

sukuriant 15y ago
Do you like driving cars? Cars that are 'fun to drive' for me (and it's a very subjective thing) are cars where I feel like I am a part of the car. As a driver, I'm encased in the vehicle. It does what I tell it to, how I tell it to do it. It can take corners just as fast as I like them; and I can feel the g's inside the corner. tl;dr: I feel like I am the car
Willwhatley 15y ago
It's a point on a subjective continuum of how responsive the car ui is. If cars are not your preferred tool, you likely don't care and won't notice differences that would stand out to a self identified 'driver'. I like fountain pens. I process using a good steel or gold nib as a sensual satisfaction similar in degree (although not kind) to a good backscratch. Some pens are fun to write with. Some ... .
btbuilder 15y ago
It's subjective of course. My definition is responsive steering combined with a relatively stiff chassis/suspension setup so you can feel the road and how the car is performing.
code_pockets 15y ago
It's really a simple term used to describe a combination of factors that create the sense of pleasure on certain individuals. Though it is highly subjective, and varies from person to person. Some people describe a car to be fun to drive when the performance of the vehicle matches their preferences. That is why you have a segment that enjoys Ford Mustangs for their straight-line acceleration (and calls them fun to drive), and you also have another segment that enjoys the Mazda Miata for its sport-tuned suspension, short tranmission gearing (which allows the engine to stay on the powerband with less effort), and low weight (and also calls them fun to drive). There are a thousand different ways that a car can be fun to drive. Some are not even related in any way to the actual car, but to the sentimental value that the owner puts on the vehicle. The most fun to drive car I've ever had was a sub-compact that barely had eighty-eight horsepower. Yet it did not consume much fuel. Such attibute pushed me to find how far I could go before needing to refuel. That alone made the car fun to drive. The Mercedes owner above values the rich set of features that his vehicle has. He seems to enjoy knowing that his vehicle is highly equipped to whithstand and accident, and is even able to reduce the chances of one actually happen. Plus I bet he loves driving past store windows, and see himself driving such a fine automobile. I know I would. =)
- olalonde 15y ago
  > Though it is highly objective, and varies from person to person. I think you meant subjective ;)
  - code_pockets 15y ago
    Yes, yes I do. The more languages one speaks, the less one speaks one. :D
Kluny 15y ago
I used to wash cars at a Mercedes lot, so I've driven a lot of Benzes. I think what makes them fun to drive is their responsiveness and power. By responsiveness, I mean it takes only a light touch on the steering wheel to move it at low speeds, and a light touch on the throttle to get an impressive feeling of power. They have a lot of steering lock, which means that you can turn the wheels pretty far to the left or right, allowing the car to be very maneuverable for it's size. As for power - well, my daily driver is a 76 Toyota Corona. The Corona has the same smooth, comfortable ride as a Benz, but boy does it ever take a while to get moving, and it's very hard to maneuver at low speeds, like in parking lots. My other vehicle is an 83 Kawasaki GPZ 305 - a very small displacement motorbike. It's very torquey, and from a standing start it can get up to highway speed very fast. But once you're at highway speed, that's about as fast as it's going to go. If you find yourself riding abreast of an erratic driver in the lane beside you, with someone else behind you, you might want to accelerate away from them. As quick as the motorbike is at low speeds, it will take more seconds that you would like to drop the car beside you at highway speed. In the benz, you can tap the pedal and pass like the other cars are standing still. And it still gets going from a standing start faster than most other cars on the road. For the record, the car I'm thinking of when I say "the benz" is a current C300, or maybe a C63.
joshmlewis 15y ago
What fun to drive means to me: I have a 2000 Mustang GT. If you punch the throttle you hear a monster come out of the engine and set you back in your seat, you get this interesting feeling in your chest as you rapidly gain speed, and when you finally let off, the strangest thing happens: you smile.
- code_pockets 15y ago
  Is it stock?
  - joshmlewis 15y ago
    Nope. It has about 300HP at the wheels. It's super fun.
wisty 15y ago
It's how they are tuned to be "fun". They might make the engines extra noisy for a second after you hit the throttle, so it makes an exciting "zrooom". Performance can vary with speed - at low speeds, after you've been driving a few minuets, they might go into racecar mode. At higher speeds, or when you are just starting driving, they'll re-tune for safety. Basically, the car should "feel" responsive. When you change what you are doing (i.e. accelerating) it should respond with a lot of gusto. The trick is, not doing this when the driver doesn't want it.

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

joshu 15y ago

Really? I find them generally bland. And I've driven quite a few things.

deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
Kluny 15y ago
I agree, Benzes are a bit bland. They don't give you as much physical feedback as a BMW, they're not as low and stiff as a Porsche, they're not as light and agile as an 86 Corolla, they're not as quick as a Subaru. But when you think about the fact that most people only drive a few cars in their lifetimes, and the first couple cars are something like a Honda Civic or a Mazda Protege, the first experience with a fine German automobile is going to be anything but bland. Most people get new vehicles every five or ten years - I get a new car or bike every couple of months (I'm not rich, I just buy cheap and flip them for various reasons) and I worked at a dealership, so I'm just as familiar with the flaws of Benzes as the strong points. You must have a similar experience. We're just spoiled, is all.
- joshu 15y ago
  Ok, fair enough. And there are times when you don't want much feedback. What have you had lately that you liked?

garindra 15y ago

An interesting video about a Google VP who was saved by his Mercedes car : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XXypu3dVPM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XXypu3dVPM

mixmastamyk 15y ago

I'd appreciate a car that can moderately hit the breaks when it senses you approaching a stopped car.

kalleboo 15y ago
Volvos (among others I presume, since this feature is 4 years old by now) do that http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPO6iRetpyc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPO6iRetpyc
- ed209 15y ago
  Only both Volvo [1] and Mercedes [2] both forgot to switch the system on for the press! [1] http://youtu.be/QJ6z3IArINI?t=32s http://youtu.be/QJ6z3IArINI?t=32s [2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBy78UJ081w http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBy78UJ081w
  - mixmastamyk 15y ago
    Thanks. Unless they were prototypes I don't understand why the system isn't always on, or at least difficult to turn off.
encoderer 15y ago
Actually this tech does exist on the S-Class (and presuably the CL as well). Those cars are still a little beyond my grasp -- I had a C and now a CLS -- but the wonderful thing about this tech is watching it trickle down from the top of their range down through the $32,000 C Class.

iamgilesbowkett 15y ago

I've been thinking about this quite a bit recently because I'm about to buy a car. Mini Coopers are another make with a ton of built-in computers. However, every time I do a search on reliability I find people talking casually about gigantic maintenance costs. I saw a used 1999 Mercedes SUV for $5K, googled it, and saw reviews where people were spending $4000 per year to maintain it -- and that was back in 1999 when it was new! Why spend $4000 yearly to maintain a $5000 vehicle? Might as well just buy a new one every year. Similarly, you can usually pick up a Porsche Boxster for only around $10K once they hit the 50K miles mark, because Porsche recommends an expensive scheduled servicing at the 60K miles mark. I think it's about $12K. (In actuality the car doesn't need all the things they do in that service, just some subset.) But still. It just offends me as an engineer that "better" cars have higher maintenance costs. If Mercedes is so much better at making cars than Honda, why can't it make cars that don't break? Honda makes cars that don't break. Why is the "best" car company out there unable to solve a technical problem that the "crappy" company solved twenty years ago? Not trying to troll the Merc fanboys, it just gets my goat. I had basically given up on ever owning a nice car, because of sheer nerdrage, but I found out Honda's S2000 has a fantastic reputation for reliability. So that's my plan. Please excuse the threadjack.

encoderer 15y ago
To be fair, I think perceptions about reliability trail 5+ years. Mercedes and BMW had several years of severe quality control issues from, oh, late 90s to 2005-6. Not across every model, and not equally for both makes, but there's a lot of evidence of issues. During that time, Honda and Toyota were making wonderfully reliable cars. But look at the recent toyotas. Same story for American cars. The last few years Ford has been making cars w/ the fewest defects. But perception lags. The good thing is, there are consumer reports and other agencies that track defects per 1000 cars. I've bought 2 Mercedes cars since 2007 and they both have ranked wonderfully on the consumer reports and, anecdotally, my ownership has been entirely free of defects. I'm not sure what you mean about "4000 a year to maintain" a car that was brand new. Yes, I do have to have the oil changed yearly, and there are other maintenance tasks at normal intervals. But $4000 a year in maintenance on a Mercedes is fiction.