4 ms·

I guess I would say that subcontractors are more like hourly workers (who are time tracked meticulously in almost all industries) - not salaried like software e

I guess I would say that subcontractors are more like hourly workers (who are time tracked meticulously in almost all industries) - not salaried like software engineers, who would deserve the respect and absence of tracking.

agloe_dreams 3y ago
Not really, in the housing industry, it is generally job bid instead. The contractor taking longer just means they get paid later and don't get as many jobs done. Also, Unions hate this right?
- StephenSmith 3y ago
  It's less about tracking how long they're there and more about when they showed up. We do the former because we can, but the GC really wants to know if and when their subs are showing up without having to be on site 24/7 waiting for them. For example, they can look back through yesterdays events to see that their plumber showed up - and then they'll know they need to go check on the work. The alternative is trying to get the plumber on the phone to figure out if the work had been completed or not - which is difficult in 2023. There's not a lot of unioned workers in most states for residential construction. But autoworkers, and anything else in manufacturing would be used to the constant monitoring. Commercial construction also typically has fulltime site superintendents, who would do this anyway.
  - agloe_dreams 3y ago
    That's an interesting angle. My Father actually, by chance, owns a residential drywall and finishing business. The 'did the plumber show up' factor is key. Though I'm not sure why this couldn't be solved by having the subs of a builder agree to give basic job updates. How do residential customers feel about someone's camera watching their house?
    - StephenSmith 3y ago
      Anything that makes the GC more efficient is going to be a win for the future homeowner. This might get more problematic for remodels, but we primarily work with new home builds. The GC can often bill it down to the homeowner as antitheft, which reduces time/money to complete the build. The biggest being time. An example, if custom windows are stolen, it could delay a project by months right now.
    - sulam 3y ago
      If you've worked with these people you know that there's nothing "basic" about getting job updates.
talldatethrow 3y ago
I would argue salary employees deserve more tracking since they are given more freedoms. An hourly worker is paid hourly, and given tasks at a much smaller interval.. often by day and sometimes every few hours. If you have quarterly goals for salary employees, they probably need more 'tracking' to make sure they are doing what you expect as time goes on.
ryandrake 3y ago
Thanks to both the parent for raising the ethical issues in this product and to OP for responding/addressing them. Our industry gets a lot better when we don't shy away from both asking and answering these kinds of questions!
whywhywouldyou 3y ago
So to clarify: as long as a worker is hourly, they don't deserve any privacy or respect, and can be surveilled at will. That's pretty incredible.
- jschveibinz 3y ago
  Hourly means “paid by the hour,” so verifying time on the job is directly related to salary. “Punching in” on remote worksites is the problem being solved with this solution.

agloe_dreams 3y ago

Not really, in the housing industry, it is generally job bid instead. The contractor taking longer just means they get paid later and don't get as many jobs done. Also, Unions hate this right?

StephenSmith 3y ago
It's less about tracking how long they're there and more about when they showed up. We do the former because we can, but the GC really wants to know if and when their subs are showing up without having to be on site 24/7 waiting for them. For example, they can look back through yesterdays events to see that their plumber showed up - and then they'll know they need to go check on the work. The alternative is trying to get the plumber on the phone to figure out if the work had been completed or not - which is difficult in 2023. There's not a lot of unioned workers in most states for residential construction. But autoworkers, and anything else in manufacturing would be used to the constant monitoring. Commercial construction also typically has fulltime site superintendents, who would do this anyway.
- agloe_dreams 3y ago
  That's an interesting angle. My Father actually, by chance, owns a residential drywall and finishing business. The 'did the plumber show up' factor is key. Though I'm not sure why this couldn't be solved by having the subs of a builder agree to give basic job updates. How do residential customers feel about someone's camera watching their house?
  - StephenSmith 3y ago
    Anything that makes the GC more efficient is going to be a win for the future homeowner. This might get more problematic for remodels, but we primarily work with new home builds. The GC can often bill it down to the homeowner as antitheft, which reduces time/money to complete the build. The biggest being time. An example, if custom windows are stolen, it could delay a project by months right now.
  - sulam 3y ago
    If you've worked with these people you know that there's nothing "basic" about getting job updates.

talldatethrow 3y ago

I would argue salary employees deserve more tracking since they are given more freedoms. An hourly worker is paid hourly, and given tasks at a much smaller interval.. often by day and sometimes every few hours. If you have quarterly goals for salary employees, they probably need more 'tracking' to make sure they are doing what you expect as time goes on.

ryandrake 3y ago

Thanks to both the parent for raising the ethical issues in this product and to OP for responding/addressing them. Our industry gets a lot better when we don't shy away from both asking and answering these kinds of questions!

whywhywouldyou 3y ago

So to clarify: as long as a worker is hourly, they don't deserve any privacy or respect, and can be surveilled at will. That's pretty incredible.

jschveibinz 3y ago
Hourly means “paid by the hour,” so verifying time on the job is directly related to salary. “Punching in” on remote worksites is the problem being solved with this solution.