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The "Spanish Theory" of software project management
- qntm 15y ago> In practice what this often means for the developer is unpaid overtime (also known as "crunch time"), something very familiar to game developers, and also common in traditional software development, as the project nears its deadline. But those unpaid hours are actually costing you, the developer, because you can't get them back. Sure you can. A good employer will give you time off in lieu later. Of course, an even better employer would never let it come to that.
- youlost_thegame 15y agoAnd also I agree to work overtime near deadlines because my employer lets me super flexible work time when there's not much work. So it's a tradeoff. Of course, if your employer doesn't compensate with something, you're getting screwed. But that's true for developers, waiters, clerks, everybody, it's not something specific of our kind.
- demian 15y agoBased on the comments and complains I heard and read online (in other words: it's only my wild theory) what it seems specific of programmers is the willingness to comply, without trying to negotiate. Maybie it's because the ideal is passionate effort instead of detached profesionalism, or maybie it's because programmers are just a 'quiet bunch'.
- ojbyrne 15y agoIn days of yore they had a mechanism so that if an employer ever let it come to that, there would be financial repercussions. I believe they called it "time and a half."
- qntm 15y agoPoint being, no amount of money can replace time spent off work with your family. What are you going to do, pay your spouse and children as an alternative to actually eating dinner with them? Only replacement time can make up for that sacrifice.
- philwelch 15y agoExcept when you take flex time out of the working day, it doesn't come at dinnertime, it comes when your spouse is still at work and your kids are still at school or maybe at their afterschool thing.
- ojbyrne 15y agoActually my point was, that rather than an absolute ("no amount of time can replace time spent off work with family"), there was a market mechanism that did a pretty good job of letting individual employees/employers manage the tradeoffs between work and non-work. Somehow (Republicans) that mechanism became deprecated, and has been replaced by conflict and bullshit.
- josemariaruiz 15y agoI'm Spanish and I approve this article! I didn't knew that there was a "Spanish Management Theory" ;), it seems we are just giving the world awesome things... like the Spanish Flu.
- tropin 15y agoExcept the only relation between the Spanish Flu and Spain was that Spanish newspapers were the firsts writing about it, as they weren't as censored as the ones published in countries fighting WWI.
- mahmud 15y agoThey nap in the afternoon, they publish uncensored news .. is there anything those Spaniards are good for?
- josemariaruiz 15y agoAnd you forgot about food and weather ;)
- nakkiel 15y agoNot to mention the friendly late-evening dinner in the summer. Suddenly missing Northern Spain and Southern France :(
- lesterbuck 15y ago>it seems we are just giving the world awesome things... like the Spanish Flu At first glance, I read that as Spanish Fly. Another awesome thing from Spain...
- josemariaruiz 15y agoThere even a not written rule in Spanish companies: «you never leave the work office before your boss». Effort in Spain only correlates to the time spent in the office and not with results. That is the reason why telecommuting never really took off in Spain.
- astrofinch 15y agoLet's go disrupt their economy.
- cantrevealname 15y agoThis meme about how unfair it is that programmers work unpaid overtime is starting to drive me nuts. I've been in big stodgy software company where everyone worked exactly 8 hours, and the whole company filed out the door at 5pm as if a factory whistle had blown. I've also worked at a smallish software company where the norm was at least 10 or 11 hours a day, and half the programmers came in on Saturdays and Sundays (and I did too). I much preferred the latter. Why? The work was more interesting, and the programmers were smarter (and nicer!), but the main reason I preferred it is, "What's the alternative for my free time?" What do you really do with the rest of the day? Yeah, sure, you have great "personal life with your family". But really, the typical programmer at BOTH companies was single, didn't have a girlfriend, and didn't have many friends. The free time was wasted on video games, lots and lots of video games, mindless chatter at a bar, watching team sports,... you get idea. Let's stop with the whining and sniveling about unpaid overtime among programmers. The average programmer is well paid, his work is usually interesting, and his free time will be squandered (applies to me too). I prefer to be at work where at least I'm doing something real.
- cujo 15y agoMaybe I'm missing your point, but from what I gather, no one should be whining about unpaid overtime because you don't think programmers have social lives and their time is better spent working for free. Have you heard the expression, "Speak for yourself"? It applies to you here.
- cantrevealname 15y agoBut the OP is speaking to all software developers, and I'm offering an alternative viewpoint. > no one should be whining about unpaid overtime Do I think that I and other programmers should be paid for overtime? Yes, of course I do. I would gladly accept payment. My point is that this complaint about unpaid programmer time is becoming a recurring theme, as if it's a huge and terrible problem. What's next: programmers forming a union like Detroit auto workers.
- mikeash 15y ago
- mathattack 15y agoI was a bignpropknent of OT for non managers since they have less control. The danger with paying managers OT is every hour they do "make work" causes the organization to spend 10 more so you don't want to invent that. OT policies encourage managers to properly staff from the start.
- Drbble 15y agoYour concern applies only any creative professional work where time input and work output are not clearly correlated, not just management, though.
- mathattack 15y agoThe challenge with management is the costs of waste get externalized and multiplied.
- Gravityloss 15y agoUmm, didn't England (and later Scotland) exactly extract the wealth from the ground, in the form of coal, which enabled the industrial revolution. Spanish coal on the other hand seems difficult to mine. Cue Jared Diamond and all that "there's actually a reason for that" can of worms.
- stef25 15y agoI'm in a situation now where, instead of walking 10min / day back and forth to the office my boss is expecting me to commute on buses and trains 4hrs / day (not exaggerating). I consider this extra commuting time as unpaid overtime (up to 20hrs a week, even though I'm not "working") and hence want to deal with it as this article says I should: "No way, I quit". Yet I feel bad about this; what would you do?
- pmjordan 15y agoDon't feel bad about it. Unless you just moved 2 hours away from your workplace it's not your fault.
- defen 15y agoA daily four hour commute is horrifically bad for your health (both mental and physical). You absolutely should not feel bad about quitting or demanding to be allowed to telecommute.
- Natsu 15y agoAssuming you worked ~40 hours/week before, this extra 20 hours means that your hourly wage is roughly 33% lower. What would you do if asked to take a 33% cut in pay?
- mikeash 15y agoWhy would you feel bad? This is a serious quality of life issue. 4 hours a day commuting is not acceptable for most people. Move, find an arrangement that lets you stay home, or quit. It's not your fault that your boss is making you do this.
- S4M 15y agoIs your boss trying to make you work in another office? In that case can you negotiate with him a relocation package?
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- EwanG 15y ago