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Yeah pretty much any pagan religion has some sort of post mortuary soothing story. Worth looking into?

defrost 3y ago
Seems redundant given 'pagan' means either * not Christian other religions in the Roman Empire, or (more generally) * not Christian religions. Easier to say most, if not all, religions have an afterlife story.
- ithkuil 3y ago
  Yeah I love picking nits too. I just meant to reaffirm that it's not an Abrahamic religion innovation.
  - defrost 3y ago
    I have trouble working out who the pagans are: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-20/the-christian-converts-who-are-setting-fire-to-sacred-aboriginal/11527402 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-20/the-christian-convert...
    - ithkuil 3y ago
      Pagan: "a person holding religious beliefs other than those of the main or recognized religions." whatever that means
- FrustratedMonky 3y ago
  To the Romans, weren't Christians the Pagans. They were some fringe group from the frontier with some wacky ideas.
  - defrost 3y ago
    If that's a question then no, the Romans did not use the word pagan to refer to Christians. The early usage (according to the OED) was [ad. L. pāgān-us, orig. ‘villager, rustic; civilian, non-militant’, opposed to mīlēs ‘soldier, one of the army’, in Christian L. (Tertullian, Augustine) ‘heathen’ as opposed to Christian or Jewish. The Christians called themselves mīlitēs ‘enrolled soldiers’ of Christ, members of his militant church, and applied to non-Christians the term applied by soldiers to all who were ‘not enrolled in the army’. Cf. Tertullian De Corona Militis xi, ‘Apud hunc [Christum] tam miles est paganus fidelis quam paganus est miles infidelis’. See also Gibbon xxi. Cf. payen. The explanation of L. pāgānus in the sense ‘non-Christian, heathen’, as arising out of that of ‘villager, rustic’, (supposedly indicating the fact that the ancient idolatry lingered on in the rural villages and hamlets after Christianity had been generally accepted in the towns and cities of the Roman Empire: see Trench Study of Words 102, and cf. Orosius i Præf. ‘Ex locorum agrestium compitis et pagis pagani vocantur’) has been shown to be chronologically and historically untenable, for this use of the word goes back to Tertullian c 202, when paganism was still the public and dominant religion, and even appears, according to Lanciani, in an epitaph of the 2nd cent.] 1. One of a nation or community which does not hold the true religion, or does not worship the true God; a heathen. (†In earlier use practically = non-Christian, and so including Muslims and, sometimes, Jews.) 2. fig. or allusively. A person of heathenish character or habits, or one who holds a position analogous to that of a heathen in relation to Christian society. etc.
    - FrustratedMonky 3y ago
      Guess I wasn't implying that Romans literally used the word "Pagan" as we use it today, but they had their own religion before Christianity, and also had a word for other religions. So just like Christians call others pagans, The Romans had a word to call out others. (thus my main point, everyone thinks they are the 'one', and have a word to disparage others). So maybe they didn't use Pagan, but Figuratively, they thought of Christians as the weird/low class/savage, "A person of heathenish character or habits, or one who holds a position analogous to that of a heathen". If you are disputing this because by definition "Pagan" means non-Christian, thus by definition Christians can't be "Pagan". Fine, how about "Superstitio"? Suetonius and Tacitus used the terms "superstitio" "On the other hand, Romans believed Christians, who were thought to take part in strange rituals and nocturnal rites, cultivated a dangerous and superstitious" sect.[60]: 125
- soligern 3y ago
  How interesting. Is there any religion without any opinion on the afterlife or is that the unifying thing for all religions.

Seems redundant given 'pagan' means either * not Christian other religions in the Roman Empire, or (more generally) * not Christian religions. Easier to say most, if not all, religions have an afterlife story.

ithkuil 3y ago
Yeah I love picking nits too. I just meant to reaffirm that it's not an Abrahamic religion innovation.
- defrost 3y ago
  I have trouble working out who the pagans are: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-20/the-christian-converts-who-are-setting-fire-to-sacred-aboriginal/11527402 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-20/the-christian-convert...
  - ithkuil 3y ago
    Pagan: "a person holding religious beliefs other than those of the main or recognized religions." whatever that means
FrustratedMonky 3y ago
To the Romans, weren't Christians the Pagans. They were some fringe group from the frontier with some wacky ideas.
- defrost 3y ago
  If that's a question then no, the Romans did not use the word pagan to refer to Christians. The early usage (according to the OED) was [ad. L. pāgān-us, orig. ‘villager, rustic; civilian, non-militant’, opposed to mīlēs ‘soldier, one of the army’, in Christian L. (Tertullian, Augustine) ‘heathen’ as opposed to Christian or Jewish. The Christians called themselves mīlitēs ‘enrolled soldiers’ of Christ, members of his militant church, and applied to non-Christians the term applied by soldiers to all who were ‘not enrolled in the army’. Cf. Tertullian De Corona Militis xi, ‘Apud hunc [Christum] tam miles est paganus fidelis quam paganus est miles infidelis’. See also Gibbon xxi. Cf. payen. The explanation of L. pāgānus in the sense ‘non-Christian, heathen’, as arising out of that of ‘villager, rustic’, (supposedly indicating the fact that the ancient idolatry lingered on in the rural villages and hamlets after Christianity had been generally accepted in the towns and cities of the Roman Empire: see Trench Study of Words 102, and cf. Orosius i Præf. ‘Ex locorum agrestium compitis et pagis pagani vocantur’) has been shown to be chronologically and historically untenable, for this use of the word goes back to Tertullian c 202, when paganism was still the public and dominant religion, and even appears, according to Lanciani, in an epitaph of the 2nd cent.] 1. One of a nation or community which does not hold the true religion, or does not worship the true God; a heathen. (†In earlier use practically = non-Christian, and so including Muslims and, sometimes, Jews.) 2. fig. or allusively. A person of heathenish character or habits, or one who holds a position analogous to that of a heathen in relation to Christian society. etc.
  - FrustratedMonky 3y ago
    Guess I wasn't implying that Romans literally used the word "Pagan" as we use it today, but they had their own religion before Christianity, and also had a word for other religions. So just like Christians call others pagans, The Romans had a word to call out others. (thus my main point, everyone thinks they are the 'one', and have a word to disparage others). So maybe they didn't use Pagan, but Figuratively, they thought of Christians as the weird/low class/savage, "A person of heathenish character or habits, or one who holds a position analogous to that of a heathen". If you are disputing this because by definition "Pagan" means non-Christian, thus by definition Christians can't be "Pagan". Fine, how about "Superstitio"? Suetonius and Tacitus used the terms "superstitio" "On the other hand, Romans believed Christians, who were thought to take part in strange rituals and nocturnal rites, cultivated a dangerous and superstitious" sect.[60]: 125
soligern 3y ago
How interesting. Is there any religion without any opinion on the afterlife or is that the unifying thing for all religions.