4 ms·

physicists/proper engineers: how useful would the electrical properties of a room temperature superconductor be, say usable as wires and only 10x the cost of al

physicists/proper engineers: how useful would the electrical properties of a room temperature superconductor be, say usable as wires and only 10x the cost of aluminium or copper or whatever high tension wires are made out of? the web suggests resistive losses are O(10%), which doesn't seem hugely important in the scheme of things. or would it be more useful for conductors in some other space? generators/turbines?

raziel2701 3y ago
Useful? It would be a veritable revolution if we had access to room temperature, ambient pressure superconductors. Applications would be everywhere, even new ones would arise from people tinkering with it.
inhumantsar 3y ago
Not a physicist or engineer but I can speak to it as a layman. Superconductors enable some deep magnetic magic which is used in all kinds of things from fusion reactors to MRI machines. Current superconductors require cryogenic temperatures to operate though, which limits their applications, makes them extremely expensive to operate, and too complicated for large scale manufacturing. An ambient temperature superconductor, even if the material itself was hideously expensive, would make these extraordinarily powerful technologies much easier to develop and deploy.
- bananapub 3y ago
  > how useful would the *electrical* properties
mitthrowaway2 3y ago
Extremely useful! For one, it would allow current-based forms of memory storage. Right now, non-volatile memory is always stored as a voltage*, because static charges can be held without decay. Superconductors allow that for current. This also is great for sensors. For example whereas a copper ring will have a brief current when exposed to a changing magnetic field, a superconductor will have a current that perfectly tracks and cancels any magnetic flux it is exposed to. It can bring AC effects down to DC. And due to zero losses (and zero Nyquist noise), it could be used to, for example, make more sensitive antennas. Secondly, even if you don't care about the losses in terms of power consumption, you almost always care about losses in terms of heat. Superconductive motor windings, for example, would allow motors to not only be more efficient, they could also be much more power-dense because of less heat generation. And then there are the really fun applications, like levitation. * (Or eg. a ferromagnet)
- EA-3167 3y ago
  You could probably make a FAR more compact MRI too, along with hundreds of other massive breakthroughs. A room-temp, ambient pressure superconductor is a world-changer on the same level as a new battery technology with thousands of times the energy density of existing tech. It's almost impossible for one person to list all of the ways technology would change, and the world with it.
amluto 3y ago
Let’s keep it simple and assume we has a really awesome superconductor: critical temperature of 100C (so it keeps superconducting even if it gets decently hot), a high critical field (so you can make electromagnets and such out of it), good mechanical properties so it makes nice wire, and cheap. It would be awesome. Off the top of my head: Big electromagnets would use it: MRI machines, magnetic plasma machines (fusion reactors), industrial magnets (for lifting), etc. A lot of the size and complexity of some MRI machines is the cooling system for the magnets — this would be unnecessary. There are designs for superconducting transformers that could be smaller and more efficient than current transformers. Long distance power transmission would be considerably cheaper at high power levels. I can imagine that some interesting motor and generator designs would become possible.
travisporter 3y ago
O notation for resistive loss is breaking my brain
simple10 3y ago
Eliminating friction and heat loss from nearly every aspect of transportation industry and electricity transfer. From The Electrochemical Society [1]: "More exciting is the prospect of finding materials in which superconductivity occurs at higher, more usable temperatures. If long-distance power lines could be made of superconducting materials, for example, electric bills would plummet." [1] https://www.electrochem.org/superconductors https://www.electrochem.org/superconductors
jacquesm 3y ago
It would be amazing, but that's precisely why you should be skeptical. This is prime fodder for the 'wouldn't it be great if we could do 'x'' kind of mental trap. But applications of a room temperature superconductor aren't lacking (it would be a gamechanger for everything electrical and electronic), it's the material that we don't have. So until I can bench test it or someone whose reputation I trust has bench tested it for me it doesn't exist.

raziel2701 3y ago

Useful? It would be a veritable revolution if we had access to room temperature, ambient pressure superconductors. Applications would be everywhere, even new ones would arise from people tinkering with it.

inhumantsar 3y ago

Not a physicist or engineer but I can speak to it as a layman. Superconductors enable some deep magnetic magic which is used in all kinds of things from fusion reactors to MRI machines. Current superconductors require cryogenic temperatures to operate though, which limits their applications, makes them extremely expensive to operate, and too complicated for large scale manufacturing. An ambient temperature superconductor, even if the material itself was hideously expensive, would make these extraordinarily powerful technologies much easier to develop and deploy.

bananapub 3y ago
> how useful would the *electrical* properties

mitthrowaway2 3y ago

Extremely useful! For one, it would allow current-based forms of memory storage. Right now, non-volatile memory is always stored as a voltage*, because static charges can be held without decay. Superconductors allow that for current. This also is great for sensors. For example whereas a copper ring will have a brief current when exposed to a changing magnetic field, a superconductor will have a current that perfectly tracks and cancels any magnetic flux it is exposed to. It can bring AC effects down to DC. And due to zero losses (and zero Nyquist noise), it could be used to, for example, make more sensitive antennas. Secondly, even if you don't care about the losses in terms of power consumption, you almost always care about losses in terms of heat. Superconductive motor windings, for example, would allow motors to not only be more efficient, they could also be much more power-dense because of less heat generation. And then there are the really fun applications, like levitation. * (Or eg. a ferromagnet)

EA-3167 3y ago
You could probably make a FAR more compact MRI too, along with hundreds of other massive breakthroughs. A room-temp, ambient pressure superconductor is a world-changer on the same level as a new battery technology with thousands of times the energy density of existing tech. It's almost impossible for one person to list all of the ways technology would change, and the world with it.

amluto 3y ago

Let’s keep it simple and assume we has a really awesome superconductor: critical temperature of 100C (so it keeps superconducting even if it gets decently hot), a high critical field (so you can make electromagnets and such out of it), good mechanical properties so it makes nice wire, and cheap. It would be awesome. Off the top of my head: Big electromagnets would use it: MRI machines, magnetic plasma machines (fusion reactors), industrial magnets (for lifting), etc. A lot of the size and complexity of some MRI machines is the cooling system for the magnets — this would be unnecessary. There are designs for superconducting transformers that could be smaller and more efficient than current transformers. Long distance power transmission would be considerably cheaper at high power levels. I can imagine that some interesting motor and generator designs would become possible.

travisporter 3y ago

O notation for resistive loss is breaking my brain

simple10 3y ago

Eliminating friction and heat loss from nearly every aspect of transportation industry and electricity transfer. From The Electrochemical Society [1]: "More exciting is the prospect of finding materials in which superconductivity occurs at higher, more usable temperatures. If long-distance power lines could be made of superconducting materials, for example, electric bills would plummet." [1] https://www.electrochem.org/superconductors https://www.electrochem.org/superconductors

jacquesm 3y ago

It would be amazing, but that's precisely why you should be skeptical. This is prime fodder for the 'wouldn't it be great if we could do 'x'' kind of mental trap. But applications of a room temperature superconductor aren't lacking (it would be a gamechanger for everything electrical and electronic), it's the material that we don't have. So until I can bench test it or someone whose reputation I trust has bench tested it for me it doesn't exist.