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I'm somewhat sympathetic to this because oil companies suppressed research, but society has known about this risk for a long time and benefited from oil. I put

I'm somewhat sympathetic to this because oil companies suppressed research, but society has known about this risk for a long time and benefited from oil. I put more of the fault with consumers, voters, and lawmakers. Oil companies just produced when they asked for.

tfourb 3y ago
There is enough blame to go around but simply ignoring the responsibility of oil companies doesn't serve the debate, either. By that logic, the producers of Zyklon-B should have been cleared of any wrongdoing because they simply satisfied the Nazi regime's demand for a nerve agent to kill people in concentration camps. Simply ignoring severe known negative externalities associated with your product should always come with legal liability.
- sBqQu3U0wH 3y ago
  Zyklon-B is not a "nerve agent" and was primarily used as a pesticide.
  - tfourb 3y ago
    You are correct sorry for the mixup (I guess "blood agent" would be more correct). Its primary use is of no consequence for this analogy, though. The company that manufactured Zyklon-B did provide it to concentration camps knowing it would be used to harm people and the executives responsible for this decision were sentenced by allied justices to death and prison terms as a consequence.
footlose_3815 3y ago
Those poor oil companies and their windfall profits somebody should help them out
mattm 3y ago
The makers of opioids are just producing what they asked for too. Companies should be expected to pay the true cost of what they produce and not have it be borne by the rest of society.
- andsoitis 3y ago
  Shareholders of companies should be held accountable, no? They’re the ones asking for more profits… Or what about our current government who recently demanded oil companies produce more to lower prices? Am I as democratic voter morally in the wrong? If not, why not?
  - kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
    If you build a city in the Sahara who do you blame for it being hot? If you build a city where the geography creates a heat dome who do you blame for it being hot?
  - tfourb 3y ago
    How about an "all of the above" approach: - you are morally wrong if you don't factor climate change and its repercussions on you, your children and other people into your voting decision - shareholders should be held accountable - companies should be held accountable - governments should be held accountable The lawsuit in question attempts one of these approaches, but feel free to work on any of the others, many others already do ;-) Regarding the specific "but what about Joe Biden asking for cheaper gasoline" question: Joe Biden was without a doubt the better candidate for combating climate change in the last U.S. presidential election. No need to doubt your morality (if you voted for him) in that regard. But of course there are many (primary) elections and climate change should probably be a factor for you and everybody else.

tfourb 3y ago

There is enough blame to go around but simply ignoring the responsibility of oil companies doesn't serve the debate, either. By that logic, the producers of Zyklon-B should have been cleared of any wrongdoing because they simply satisfied the Nazi regime's demand for a nerve agent to kill people in concentration camps. Simply ignoring severe known negative externalities associated with your product should always come with legal liability.

sBqQu3U0wH 3y ago
Zyklon-B is not a "nerve agent" and was primarily used as a pesticide.
- tfourb 3y ago
  You are correct sorry for the mixup (I guess "blood agent" would be more correct). Its primary use is of no consequence for this analogy, though. The company that manufactured Zyklon-B did provide it to concentration camps knowing it would be used to harm people and the executives responsible for this decision were sentenced by allied justices to death and prison terms as a consequence.

footlose_3815 3y ago

Those poor oil companies and their windfall profits somebody should help them out

mattm 3y ago

The makers of opioids are just producing what they asked for too. Companies should be expected to pay the true cost of what they produce and not have it be borne by the rest of society.

andsoitis 3y ago
Shareholders of companies should be held accountable, no? They’re the ones asking for more profits… Or what about our current government who recently demanded oil companies produce more to lower prices? Am I as democratic voter morally in the wrong? If not, why not?
- kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
  If you build a city in the Sahara who do you blame for it being hot? If you build a city where the geography creates a heat dome who do you blame for it being hot?
- tfourb 3y ago
  How about an "all of the above" approach: - you are morally wrong if you don't factor climate change and its repercussions on you, your children and other people into your voting decision - shareholders should be held accountable - companies should be held accountable - governments should be held accountable The lawsuit in question attempts one of these approaches, but feel free to work on any of the others, many others already do ;-) Regarding the specific "but what about Joe Biden asking for cheaper gasoline" question: Joe Biden was without a doubt the better candidate for combating climate change in the last U.S. presidential election. No need to doubt your morality (if you voted for him) in that regard. But of course there are many (primary) elections and climate change should probably be a factor for you and everybody else.