5 ms·
Nah, that's bs. Sure, if you are unskilled worker that's struggling from paycheck to paycheck, then you might not be able to easily change work. But in our li
by Xeamek 3y ago
Nah, that's bs.
Sure, if you are unskilled worker that's struggling from paycheck to paycheck, then you might not be able to easily change work.
But in our line of work, and ESPECIALLY if you are good enough to work at something like twitter, pretending we are force to work where we are is a cope.
Sure, maybe there are some extreme instances when it is the case, there are always exceptions.
But on average, it's cringe when people who earn literally twice what the average population does talk about "job insecurity" and pretend they are in the same boat as trully struggling lower class worker.
- tro2102 3y agoDid you ignore "H1-B" on purpose?
- jrflowers 3y agoI believe the point that’s illustrated here is that it may be possible to find other work that will sponsor an H1-B visa.
- milemi 3y agoWhen you’re on H1-B you’re applying for the green card through your employer, which is a multi-year process. So even if you find an employer who will sponsor it, you’ll be going back to the end of the line.
- jrflowers 3y agoIf you already have an H1-B and are in the US there is a transfer process that is not identical to the original application process.
- milemi 3y agoOnly after labor and then I-140 have been approved, which together typically take more than a year. Also, many employers won’t start your green card application until you’ve been there for a year.
- cj 3y agoI’ve done the paperwork myself for a H1B transfer as an employer. Maybe my memory isn’t serving me well, but I don’t remember it taking more than a few weeks to a month. (This was 5 yrs ago maybe my experience is dated). I definitely remember paying additional fees to prioritize every application which significantly sped up everything.
- jrflowers 3y agoTo be clear: You are saying that if you are working in the US, having already been granted an H1-B visa, it takes more than a year to complete an H1-B transfer? Or are you talking about green cards, which is a completely different thing?
- milemi 3y agoYou replied to my comment, in which I’m explicitly talking about the green card process. Most people on H1-B are trying to get a green card. I thought you were talking about transferring the green card process, because I was talking about the green card process. Transfer is possible, but you have to be past a certain point that takes probably a couple of years, which is pretty good compared to how long I had to wait way back when.
- jrflowers 3y agoThank you for clarifying. You initially responded to my point about H1-B visas with a different issue with a different immigration process. It is very informative but has nothing to do with H1-B holders as a group categorically.
- Xeamek 3y agopartially, but even then the point still stands, altough then we adjust the pros and cons of staying at your workplace. But still, that's no way near comperable to working class who, if they loose their current job, won't have just the inconvenience of flying back home, but will actually loose their (already below standard) day-to-day nessecities
- howinteresting 3y agohttps://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_as_bad_as https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_as_bad_as
- cj 3y agoH1B workers can still switch employers, they’re not tied to the employer who originally sponsored them.
- anonymousab 3y ago> Probably, because it’s the minority of workers. How small of a minority was it for Twitter after Elon fired a supermajority of the regular FTEs?
- cj 3y agoThanks, I removed that part of my comment. The point still stands.
- williamsmj 3y agoNot if they're trying to get a green card.
- rchaud 3y agoThere's significant paperwork and delays involved in switching one's H1B permit to the new employer. For that reason, the companies you can potentially move to are limited to those that have internal processes for handling H1B-based employment.
- cj 3y agoI’ve personally (and successfully) brought a H1B employee from a BigCo into my 15 person startup (we were actually 7 people at the time of hiring them). There’s some paperwork, but it’s not a major hurdle. Maybe a few grand in legal fees and a few hours of work on the employer side.
- antiframe 3y agoAnd yet many employers refuse to do that work and will just pass on candidates that need an H1B transfer.
- 3y ago
- cowl 3y agoParent comment specifically mentioned H1B visas as the problem. It doesn't have much to do with how good you are. You can't just choose any other job. You need to find an employer who has a H1B visa Program support. While I'm sure that there are employers who offer this support and still have some quotas available, the choice is very limited in comparison with the whole line of work you are referring to, plus in this case the leverage that the employee has is very little so many will choose to stay and endure but not as a preference but just to avoid the problems.
- WalterBright 3y ago[flagged]
- NegativeK 3y agoYou're confusing "forced" to mean legal slavery and "forced" to mean that the worker would have to make very significant and unpleasant changes to their life that a reasonable person would say that they shouldn't. Nobody is trying to imply slavery. There's a whole host of behaviors that are legally unacceptable in the workplace because telling people to just get another job isn't really a solution.
- WalterBright 3y ago[flagged]
- tsimionescu 3y agoNo one is claiming Musk is forcing these people to work at Twitter. The claim is some people are forced by the visa system to choose between (a) working at a place they do not like and would not endorse, (b) leaving the country, or (c) taking a huge risk that they might have to do (b) anyway. The point is not to say that Twitter or Musk are benefitting from forced labor. The point is to say that we shouldn't think everyone working at Twitter is is endorsing Twitter's decisions or enjoying the workplace as is.
- jddj 3y agoI don't agree or disagree (well that's not true, but it's not particularly important), but I sure hope this trend of dismissing everything as a "cope" like some middleschool kid sitting up the back of the classroom doesn't survive '23. Listened to some of that twitter spaces the other day about the Russian coup and discovered that there are grown adults using that word to label just about anything that doesn't fit with their stance. It's a little embarrassing and very online.
- hifromLA 3y agoEven worse is copium. The older I get the less I enjoy spending time online.
- imbnwa 3y agoImplying clinical pathology, from "cope!" to "you need therapy", is the hallmark of modern online rhetoric
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- cscurmudgeon 3y agoMy BP raises the second I see cope used this way, I need to cope better.
- 14u2c 3y agoH1-Bs are not an "extreme instance", to they are incredibly common. At my previous company I knew a excellent engineer who was treated poorly and paid way less than he deserved. He had no choice though because loosing the job means he's kicked out of the country. Obviously he was grateful for the opportunity, but there's a flip side to it as well.
- treprinum 3y agoThat engineer could work remotely collecting $400k from a nice and cheap place these days. Imagine working from Costa Rica or somewhere in the Andes. If they were really excellent they would have landed such opportunity at some point.
- ajmurmann 3y agoMaybe they like living in the US and have friends and family there and there kids go to school there where they also have friends.
- bloopernova 3y agoAh, there it is: "if bad things happen to you, it's your fault for not working hard enough!" Amazing that someone can still hold that opinion, when all the evidence overwhelmingly contradicts that little nugget of pyrite.
- treprinum 3y agoNo, the point was that you don't have to be stuck in a bad position as an H1B abusee and can make enough $ outside USA if you are really good.
- cscurmudgeon 3y agoLol, what if they have families here?
- raverbashing 3y agoUnless your country of origin is really disadvantaged (think sanctioned), I'd say going back is an option. Or even sending CVs outside of the US. Sure, you don't need to quit on the spot, but looking for options, absolutely
- sangnoir 3y ago> But on average, it's cringe when people who earn literally twice what the average population does talk about "job insecurity" and pretend they are in the same boat as trully struggling lower class worker. Because the Hedonic treadmill exists, expenses are also higher for high-earning people than the average population's: why would you expect well-paid folk not to worry about being unable to afford paying for their car note, mortgage, child-care and other obligations. Your position would be reasonable if all costs were uniform, and people who earn double put all their money in savings and investments.