5 ms·

> Social media companies are not the ones normalizing this behavior, bad parents are. They do benefit from it or even encourage it, Remember, always blame indi

> Social media companies are not the ones normalizing this behavior, bad parents are. They do benefit from it or even encourage it, Remember, always blame individuals for systemic issues.

loeg 3y ago
Eh. Broadcasting your children to strangers isn’t how most people use social media.
- pclmulqdq 3y ago
  Most people in our circles recognize the social media is marketing for your personal brand, and use it responsibly. Many people in the wider world don't. They often see it as a way to share memories with other people or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past and most people don't have more than 256 GB of hard drive space on their phone (their only computing device).
  - derefr 3y ago
    > or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past Using a social network as a journal doesn't imply needing to post anything publicly. There are plenty of private Instagram accounts that people just use to save photos.
    - pclmulqdq 3y ago
      You're still sharing it with the one person who can do the most damage: Mark Zuckerberg.
  - loeg 3y ago
    This isn't really what I'm getting at and I don't really agree with the characterization. Saving memories and sharing with people you know is totally fine. That's very different from, e.g., monetizing your kids through short-form video.
    - pclmulqdq 3y ago
      Yeah, most people don't monetize their kids, but "likes" != monetization. You're thinking about a small minority of people who have the most serious version of this problem, but it is a lot more widespread than just people who monetize their kids.
  - ryandrake 3y ago
    > Most people in our circles recognize the social media is marketing for your personal brand Marketing for your personal brand? What on earth does that even mean? I can’t even imagine what “my personal brand” would be let alone how/why I would market it. Get me out of this narcissism dystopia!
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
  - Dalewyn 3y ago
    >256 GB of hard drive space on their phone This is really pedantic, but nobody has hard drive space on their phone. :P
- blooalien 3y ago
  Most people aren't even aware how far their "broadcast" (posts) travel, or whose hands their data ends up in these days.
nsgi 3y ago
Is Facebook encouraging people to post pictures of their kids? If they are then they shouldn't be, but parents should also have the sense not to post them
- spondylosaurus 3y ago
  I mean, in a sense, aren't they? Not as specific as "post pictures of your two-year-old having a meltdown Right Now," but the whole thing with Facebook (or any social media) is that it encourages and rewards engagement.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- em-bee 3y ago
  When parents share about their kids online, in almost all cases I can think of, they are doing it for themselves, not for the child’s benefit. i would disagree with that claim. at least when i share photos of my children the primary benefit is for my parents, my siblings, and very close friends. it is neither for my own nor my kids benefit. the point of facebook is to stay in touch with your friends and family, and so it encourages to share with them. i am not on facebook myself, so i don't know how easy it is to create private family/friend groups. if it is easy then it should not be a problem to share family pictures in private, but apparently this is not happening and a lot of people are sharing in public instead? do they believe that only the friends that follow them can see them? never mind the privacy issues of facebook itself. does it make sense to post it online instead of celebrating it privately with my child or face-to-face with friends most of my friends and family do not live in the same city as i do. so face-to-face is not an option. instead of chastising parents for using the tools available to them to stay in touch with their family, how about creating and promoting tools that allow sharing in a private and secure manner?
  - noizejoy 3y ago
    Less public sharing of pictures over the Internet has been possible ever since email with attachments became common. But it’s definitely less work to make a deal with the social network devil. Some parents do and others don’t. Some kids may later resent that. Others won’t.
chillbill 3y ago
There are no systems without the individuals that make it and propagate it. In this case it’s the parents who want to show strangers their children’s private moments.
- nielsbot 3y ago
  I understand the concept of individual responsibility but you cannot absolve the individuals who profit from dangerous systems of their responsibility either.
  - chillbill 3y ago
    I’m not absolving anyone, but it’s misguided and counter-productive to place prime responsibility on them. No one forced any parent to tout their kids on social media (or regular media) for klout and profit opportunities. If you stop social media companies, shitty parents would find another way to sell their kids for promotion. Parents should learn that their behavior is wrong and stop doing it.
    - ryandrake 3y ago
      Additionally, even if you can’t stop social media companies, my kid still isn’t on Facebook because we don’t use Facebook or post her there. The power is in the parents’ hands. The loophole is if some other parent takes a picture at a party or something that includes our kid and posts it. We try to mitigate this by telling The Facebook Moms in very clear terms that if they post pictures including our kid, then we won’t be doing anything with them anymore.
    - nielsbot 3y ago
      Are you against "protective" regulation in general or is it more about this specific case?
LAC-Tech 3y ago
I know this is meant as sarcasm, but I actually agree.
bell-cot 3y ago
Ah... So if I let my 3-year-old great-grandson play outside too long on a cold winter day, then it's Mother Nature's fault when he gets hypothermia and frostbite? Good to know.
- bbreier 3y ago
  The turning of the seasons and the weather are as immutable and absolute as social media, so this is a perfect analogy for the situation at hand.
  - octernion 3y ago
    trying to foist all the responsibility onto victims is central boomer tenant so i doubt you are going to make much progress with "making sense" and "being reasonable"
    - bell-cot 3y ago
      Sounds like you see the parents as the victims. Vs. I see the kids as the victims. I don't put any responsibility on the kids. (BTW - "families are responsible for their little kids" was a pretty normal belief long before the first boomer was born.)
  - brvsft 3y ago
    Social media is not absolute or immutable but it is systemic. Got it.
- jodrellblank 3y ago
  So if Coca Cola marshalls tens of thousands of employees and hundreds of millions of dollars, bombarding you with advertising and marketing and subtle messages on all channels all day, messages crafted by smart people who spend their whole lives studying human weaknesses and how to exploit them, messages which normalise drinking sugar water at mealtimes, as a reward, at special occasions, as a treat, at sports events, while driving, with take-out, at home, at work… All you have to do is chant “personal responsibility” and then there’s no imbalance and no unfairness and it’s all alright and everything’s perfect and it must be the victim’s fault for not being John Galt and immune to advertising like you think you are (but aren’t really because nobody is)
sezycei 3y ago
How do systemic issues come to exist if not for the actions of individuals?
- version_five 3y ago
  "Systemic" is a term made up to abdicate responsibility and/or create a bogeyman. It's more comfortable to blame "them" then yourself, either for why you can't succeed or for a societal problem.
- akomtu 3y ago
  Most of those individuals have a rather weak will, they are slaves of desires. At the same time a few individuals with a strong will and predatory mindset know how to push the weak crowd into a loop of addiction. Coca Cola is essentially a drug dealer, they even used an actual hard drug in the past to hook up customers; now they have to resort to milder chemicals to cause addiction. Fashion industry is another example: they use the desire to feel better than others or like others, and skillfully use that to manufacture a loop of addiction.

> Social media companies are not the ones normalizing this behavior, bad parents are. They do benefit from it or even encourage it, Remember, always blame individuals for systemic issues.

loeg 3y ago

Eh. Broadcasting your children to strangers isn’t how most people use social media.

pclmulqdq 3y ago
Most people in our circles recognize the social media is marketing for your personal brand, and use it responsibly. Many people in the wider world don't. They often see it as a way to share memories with other people or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past and most people don't have more than 256 GB of hard drive space on their phone (their only computing device).
- derefr 3y ago
  > or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past Using a social network as a journal doesn't imply needing to post anything publicly. There are plenty of private Instagram accounts that people just use to save photos.
  - pclmulqdq 3y ago
    You're still sharing it with the one person who can do the most damage: Mark Zuckerberg.
- loeg 3y ago
  This isn't really what I'm getting at and I don't really agree with the characterization. Saving memories and sharing with people you know is totally fine. That's very different from, e.g., monetizing your kids through short-form video.
  - pclmulqdq 3y ago
    Yeah, most people don't monetize their kids, but "likes" != monetization. You're thinking about a small minority of people who have the most serious version of this problem, but it is a lot more widespread than just people who monetize their kids.
- ryandrake 3y ago
  > Most people in our circles recognize the social media is marketing for your personal brand Marketing for your personal brand? What on earth does that even mean? I can’t even imagine what “my personal brand” would be let alone how/why I would market it. Get me out of this narcissism dystopia!
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- Dalewyn 3y ago
  >256 GB of hard drive space on their phone This is really pedantic, but nobody has hard drive space on their phone. :P
blooalien 3y ago
Most people aren't even aware how far their "broadcast" (posts) travel, or whose hands their data ends up in these days.

nsgi 3y ago

Is Facebook encouraging people to post pictures of their kids? If they are then they shouldn't be, but parents should also have the sense not to post them

spondylosaurus 3y ago
I mean, in a sense, aren't they? Not as specific as "post pictures of your two-year-old having a meltdown Right Now," but the whole thing with Facebook (or any social media) is that it encourages and rewards engagement.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
em-bee 3y ago
When parents share about their kids online, in almost all cases I can think of, they are doing it for themselves, not for the child’s benefit. i would disagree with that claim. at least when i share photos of my children the primary benefit is for my parents, my siblings, and very close friends. it is neither for my own nor my kids benefit. the point of facebook is to stay in touch with your friends and family, and so it encourages to share with them. i am not on facebook myself, so i don't know how easy it is to create private family/friend groups. if it is easy then it should not be a problem to share family pictures in private, but apparently this is not happening and a lot of people are sharing in public instead? do they believe that only the friends that follow them can see them? never mind the privacy issues of facebook itself. does it make sense to post it online instead of celebrating it privately with my child or face-to-face with friends most of my friends and family do not live in the same city as i do. so face-to-face is not an option. instead of chastising parents for using the tools available to them to stay in touch with their family, how about creating and promoting tools that allow sharing in a private and secure manner?
- noizejoy 3y ago
  Less public sharing of pictures over the Internet has been possible ever since email with attachments became common. But it’s definitely less work to make a deal with the social network devil. Some parents do and others don’t. Some kids may later resent that. Others won’t.

chillbill 3y ago

There are no systems without the individuals that make it and propagate it. In this case it’s the parents who want to show strangers their children’s private moments.

nielsbot 3y ago
I understand the concept of individual responsibility but you cannot absolve the individuals who profit from dangerous systems of their responsibility either.
- chillbill 3y ago
  I’m not absolving anyone, but it’s misguided and counter-productive to place prime responsibility on them. No one forced any parent to tout their kids on social media (or regular media) for klout and profit opportunities. If you stop social media companies, shitty parents would find another way to sell their kids for promotion. Parents should learn that their behavior is wrong and stop doing it.
  - ryandrake 3y ago
    Additionally, even if you can’t stop social media companies, my kid still isn’t on Facebook because we don’t use Facebook or post her there. The power is in the parents’ hands. The loophole is if some other parent takes a picture at a party or something that includes our kid and posts it. We try to mitigate this by telling The Facebook Moms in very clear terms that if they post pictures including our kid, then we won’t be doing anything with them anymore.
  - nielsbot 3y ago
    Are you against "protective" regulation in general or is it more about this specific case?

LAC-Tech 3y ago

I know this is meant as sarcasm, but I actually agree.

bell-cot 3y ago

Ah... So if I let my 3-year-old great-grandson play outside too long on a cold winter day, then it's Mother Nature's fault when he gets hypothermia and frostbite? Good to know.

bbreier 3y ago
The turning of the seasons and the weather are as immutable and absolute as social media, so this is a perfect analogy for the situation at hand.
- octernion 3y ago
  trying to foist all the responsibility onto victims is central boomer tenant so i doubt you are going to make much progress with "making sense" and "being reasonable"
  - bell-cot 3y ago
    Sounds like you see the parents as the victims. Vs. I see the kids as the victims. I don't put any responsibility on the kids. (BTW - "families are responsible for their little kids" was a pretty normal belief long before the first boomer was born.)
- brvsft 3y ago
  Social media is not absolute or immutable but it is systemic. Got it.
jodrellblank 3y ago
So if Coca Cola marshalls tens of thousands of employees and hundreds of millions of dollars, bombarding you with advertising and marketing and subtle messages on all channels all day, messages crafted by smart people who spend their whole lives studying human weaknesses and how to exploit them, messages which normalise drinking sugar water at mealtimes, as a reward, at special occasions, as a treat, at sports events, while driving, with take-out, at home, at work… All you have to do is chant “personal responsibility” and then there’s no imbalance and no unfairness and it’s all alright and everything’s perfect and it must be the victim’s fault for not being John Galt and immune to advertising like you think you are (but aren’t really because nobody is)

sezycei 3y ago

How do systemic issues come to exist if not for the actions of individuals?

version_five 3y ago
"Systemic" is a term made up to abdicate responsibility and/or create a bogeyman. It's more comfortable to blame "them" then yourself, either for why you can't succeed or for a societal problem.
akomtu 3y ago
Most of those individuals have a rather weak will, they are slaves of desires. At the same time a few individuals with a strong will and predatory mindset know how to push the weak crowd into a loop of addiction. Coca Cola is essentially a drug dealer, they even used an actual hard drug in the past to hook up customers; now they have to resort to milder chemicals to cause addiction. Fashion industry is another example: they use the desire to feel better than others or like others, and skillfully use that to manufacture a loop of addiction.