12 ms·

I agree with the spirit of the post, but: - You don’t need to be doing a PhD to realize that there’s something weird about sharing your intimate life stories o

I agree with the spirit of the post, but: - You don’t need to be doing a PhD to realize that there’s something weird about sharing your intimate life stories online with strangers. Might be a bit crude, but you’d have to be pretty thick not to consider it. - This part: > Social media companies, these corporate giants that have so much influence in today’s culture and the way we connect with each other, are the ones normalizing oversharing and benefiting from it This is not exactly accurate. Social media companies are not the ones normalizing this behavior, bad parents are. They do benefit from it or even encourage it, but ultimately it’s the parent’s responsibility as they are doing it only for themselves. Bad parents are not the victim, they are the problem.

elforce002 3y ago
Both are to be blamed but parents have 80% of the blame here.
- hunter-gatherer 3y ago
  I'm curious how you came up with that number.
ajdude 3y ago
I was reading recently the story of Christopher Robin, and how using his childhood stories in Winnie the Pooh haunted to him for the rest of his life and made him a subject of bullying. I can only imagine what it will be like for these kids once they're older with their whole story plastered all over Instagram.
- photonerd 3y ago
  It’s more that his parents were completely emotionally absent & preferred to (as he put it) “step on [his] infant shoulders” than have any substantial relationship. The bullying definitely was real but his parents mental neglect probably contributed at least as much—if not more—to his trauma.
Waterluvian 3y ago
I don’t disagree, but I feel the need to share a small bit of anecdata for perspective: My kids often say, “this is so cool! Can you get a photo and share it with our friends online?” Of course, anyone can take that last sentence, render it in their own context without the availability of any details to conclude that I’m a terrible parent. But that’s kind of my point: parenting is partly about making informed, nuanced decisions. You never have the information necessary to make an informed, nuanced criticism.
- chillbill 3y ago
  It’s the responsibility of the parent to work on gathering their data. Not knowing any better is not the responsibility of the child, but the parent. I would accept this probably in the early days of social media, but there is mounting evidence now that parents who monetize their kids are doing it intentionally and willingly. It’s child abuse in my book.
pwdisswordfishc 3y ago
> Social media companies are not the ones normalizing this behavior, bad parents are. They do benefit from it or even encourage it, Remember, always blame individuals for systemic issues.
- loeg 3y ago
  Eh. Broadcasting your children to strangers isn’t how most people use social media.
  - pclmulqdq 3y ago
    Most people in our circles recognize the social media is marketing for your personal brand, and use it responsibly. Many people in the wider world don't. They often see it as a way to share memories with other people or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past and most people don't have more than 256 GB of hard drive space on their phone (their only computing device).
    - derefr 3y ago
      > or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past Using a social network as a journal doesn't imply needing to post anything publicly. There are plenty of private Instagram accounts that people just use to save photos.
      - pclmulqdq 3y ago
        You're still sharing it with the one person who can do the most damage: Mark Zuckerberg.
    - loeg 3y ago
      This isn't really what I'm getting at and I don't really agree with the characterization. Saving memories and sharing with people you know is totally fine. That's very different from, e.g., monetizing your kids through short-form video.
kashunstva 3y ago
> Bad parents are not the victim, they are the problem. Parents make unwise choices in disclosing information about their children on social media. Certainly. One can debate whether it is for "Likes" as a measure of social capital or something else. But the social media companies and their symbiotic ecosystem have been anything but forthright about how they use the digital trail of such disclosures. The cohort of readers here understands it well; the wider world not so much. The dramatic asymmetry of information (what I know about their usage practices vs what they know about me and my children) virtually guarantees that I can't make a fully informed choice about what I disclose or whether I choose to do it at all.
aowijtiawjrt 3y ago
When a few individuals out of a large group are doing it, then it makes sense to blame the individuals. When millions of people are doing it because a giant force is pushing them all in the same direction, that is more or less the definition of a systemic problem.
akira2501 3y ago
> bad parents are They may be "normalizing" it, but they're definitely being "enabled" by the social media companies who create the actual "benefit" that drives the behavior in the first place. It makes me think of the California Child Actor's Bill[0], and how it sets up "Coogan Trusts." The law requires the _employer_ to set aside money into a trust completely bypassing the parents. It seems to recognize that any amount of money injected into a parent and child relationship creates unique strains that do need to be considered directly. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Child_Actor%27s_Bill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Child_Actor%27s_Bil...
oefnak 3y ago
They literally got psychologists working to find out via A B testing what is the most addictive! Of course it's their fault. It's incredible how many people on this site try to feel not responsible for all the damage the Facebook, Instagrams and TikToks of this world are doing, even though they are the ones writing the code.
- chillbill 3y ago
  You are mistaken placing responsibility to involved parties.
brnt 3y ago
> Bad parents are not the victim, they are the problem. Enabling bad behaviour because it makes you money is quite literally exploitative and therefore reprehensible. But really, it is no different than what bad parents do: refusing to stop and consider they are not actively contributing to a better world.
pdpi 3y ago
> Bad parents are not the victim, they are part of the problem It’s not an either/or situation. I would argue they are both.

elforce002 3y ago

Both are to be blamed but parents have 80% of the blame here.

hunter-gatherer 3y ago
I'm curious how you came up with that number.

ajdude 3y ago

I was reading recently the story of Christopher Robin, and how using his childhood stories in Winnie the Pooh haunted to him for the rest of his life and made him a subject of bullying. I can only imagine what it will be like for these kids once they're older with their whole story plastered all over Instagram.

photonerd 3y ago
It’s more that his parents were completely emotionally absent & preferred to (as he put it) “step on [his] infant shoulders” than have any substantial relationship. The bullying definitely was real but his parents mental neglect probably contributed at least as much—if not more—to his trauma.

Waterluvian 3y ago

I don’t disagree, but I feel the need to share a small bit of anecdata for perspective: My kids often say, “this is so cool! Can you get a photo and share it with our friends online?” Of course, anyone can take that last sentence, render it in their own context without the availability of any details to conclude that I’m a terrible parent. But that’s kind of my point: parenting is partly about making informed, nuanced decisions. You never have the information necessary to make an informed, nuanced criticism.

chillbill 3y ago
It’s the responsibility of the parent to work on gathering their data. Not knowing any better is not the responsibility of the child, but the parent. I would accept this probably in the early days of social media, but there is mounting evidence now that parents who monetize their kids are doing it intentionally and willingly. It’s child abuse in my book.

pwdisswordfishc 3y ago

> Social media companies are not the ones normalizing this behavior, bad parents are. They do benefit from it or even encourage it, Remember, always blame individuals for systemic issues.

loeg 3y ago
Eh. Broadcasting your children to strangers isn’t how most people use social media.
- pclmulqdq 3y ago
  Most people in our circles recognize the social media is marketing for your personal brand, and use it responsibly. Many people in the wider world don't. They often see it as a way to share memories with other people or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past and most people don't have more than 256 GB of hard drive space on their phone (their only computing device).
  - derefr 3y ago
    > or to save their memories, because free photo storage is a thing of the past Using a social network as a journal doesn't imply needing to post anything publicly. There are plenty of private Instagram accounts that people just use to save photos.
    - pclmulqdq 3y ago
      You're still sharing it with the one person who can do the most damage: Mark Zuckerberg.
  - loeg 3y ago
    This isn't really what I'm getting at and I don't really agree with the characterization. Saving memories and sharing with people you know is totally fine. That's very different from, e.g., monetizing your kids through short-form video.

kashunstva 3y ago

> Bad parents are not the victim, they are the problem. Parents make unwise choices in disclosing information about their children on social media. Certainly. One can debate whether it is for "Likes" as a measure of social capital or something else. But the social media companies and their symbiotic ecosystem have been anything but forthright about how they use the digital trail of such disclosures. The cohort of readers here understands it well; the wider world not so much. The dramatic asymmetry of information (what I know about their usage practices vs what they know about me and my children) virtually guarantees that I can't make a fully informed choice about what I disclose or whether I choose to do it at all.

aowijtiawjrt 3y ago

When a few individuals out of a large group are doing it, then it makes sense to blame the individuals. When millions of people are doing it because a giant force is pushing them all in the same direction, that is more or less the definition of a systemic problem.

akira2501 3y ago

> bad parents are They may be "normalizing" it, but they're definitely being "enabled" by the social media companies who create the actual "benefit" that drives the behavior in the first place. It makes me think of the California Child Actor's Bill[0], and how it sets up "Coogan Trusts." The law requires the _employer_ to set aside money into a trust completely bypassing the parents. It seems to recognize that any amount of money injected into a parent and child relationship creates unique strains that do need to be considered directly. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Child_Actor%27s_Bill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Child_Actor%27s_Bil...

oefnak 3y ago

They literally got psychologists working to find out via A B testing what is the most addictive! Of course it's their fault. It's incredible how many people on this site try to feel not responsible for all the damage the Facebook, Instagrams and TikToks of this world are doing, even though they are the ones writing the code.

chillbill 3y ago
You are mistaken placing responsibility to involved parties.

brnt 3y ago

> Bad parents are not the victim, they are the problem. Enabling bad behaviour because it makes you money is quite literally exploitative and therefore reprehensible. But really, it is no different than what bad parents do: refusing to stop and consider they are not actively contributing to a better world.

pdpi 3y ago

> Bad parents are not the victim, they are part of the problem It’s not an either/or situation. I would argue they are both.