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I have found this approach to be quite useful with my co-workers, friends and even my spouse. Sometimes I hear an idea and my initial reaction is "No," when wh

I have found this approach to be quite useful with my co-workers, friends and even my spouse. Sometimes I hear an idea and my initial reaction is "No," when what is really going on inside me is "Let me mull it over." The trick for me is to not open my mouth too soon before I've truly given the idea a chance to breathe a little.

zotz 15y ago
> The trick for me is to not open my mouth too soon before I've truly given the idea a chance to breathe a little. Silence is the ultimate wisdom. I just proved I'm a fool by even mentioning it.
- kstenerud 15y ago
  "Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses" - Boethius (If you had kept your silence, you would have stayed a philosopher)
- pshc 15y ago
  Tangental: reservation of judgement can be taken too far, becoming extreme relativism/pacifism/social signalling. http://lesswrong.com/lw/yp/pretending_to_be_wise/ http://lesswrong.com/lw/yp/pretending_to_be_wise/
tchock23 15y ago
I have to remember this with co-workers as well, but from the opposite perspective. It's a variation of the idea that "the confused mind always says no." I've learned that when people take the time to process the idea they will be able to give a more reasonable response, so I'm now more patient with the initial "no" response. In fact, I have one colleague who immediately says "no" to every one of my ideas before almost exactly one month later saying yes emphatically (and then going on to claim it as his own idea all along). It's uncanny - I have worked with him so long now that I can almost time it to the day when he will agree with my idea and claim it as his own idea all along. It used to really bother me, but not anymore - as long we get things done I don't care who "owns" the idea.
youlost_thegame 15y ago
I feel you, I also have this little voice that shouts "NO!" inside my head during meetings. But I've learned to say "I don't see it that way, but it's a good idea, let me think on that, please", which has won me a lot of respect. Even if my final answer is negative, the fact that I took some time to consider it is perceived as very positive by coworkers and managers.
- einhverfr 15y ago
  There's another tactic too... one I use frequently for better or worse. So I see someone who says something I don't entirely agree with but I want to see where they are coming from. I start arguing with them, asking the harder questions, pointing out things I see as problems, not to push back or prove that I am right, but to prove the merit of their ideas. Sometimes I will say something to indicate why I am doing it, but for people who know me, I usually skip that part. The goal is then to argue, hash things out, force people to defend their ideas, and then what's left after that session can be assumed to be better than any of us could have come up with otherwise and we go forward on it. However, there are two secrets to making this work: 1) You have to be known for actually using the ideas that are effectively defended. People need to know it's not personal and that it is both professional and empowering to them. If I argue with your idea, it is because I see potential value in it but I want to make sure it doesn't easily collapse. In some cases I will offer to stand aside remaining objections or in some cases, I will endorse the idea. 2) You have to be open to (and appreciate) everyone else doing the same to you. The point here is that it is a vetting process, and my ideas can be challenged just like everyone else's. In fact if you challenge my ideas, that's again a sign of respect. If you didn't value the ideas, you'd probably ignore them or (if they go against your stakes in the project) argue instead that they are dangerous or problematic. Being argumentative, like being defiant, is a powerful tool, used right. It just takes some time and effort to make sure that it is used right instead of being used in a way that is destructive.
  - r00fus 15y ago
    So this is the "trial-by-fire" approach. I inadvertently use it a lot as well. I'm trying to soften the approach however. However, you can also wrap that in a friendly approach as youlost_thegame mentions - simply acknowledge the potential of the idea first (ie, positive energy) then go in with the tough questions. I find even with friends and close colleagues, if I stick to the "nice first, then difficult questions combined with enthusiasm", I can often critique the idea while making the entire conversation positive. Often the faulty idea gets discarded by it's owner after consideration.

zotz 15y ago

> The trick for me is to not open my mouth too soon before I've truly given the idea a chance to breathe a little. Silence is the ultimate wisdom. I just proved I'm a fool by even mentioning it.

kstenerud 15y ago
"Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses" - Boethius (If you had kept your silence, you would have stayed a philosopher)
pshc 15y ago
Tangental: reservation of judgement can be taken too far, becoming extreme relativism/pacifism/social signalling. http://lesswrong.com/lw/yp/pretending_to_be_wise/ http://lesswrong.com/lw/yp/pretending_to_be_wise/

tchock23 15y ago

I have to remember this with co-workers as well, but from the opposite perspective. It's a variation of the idea that "the confused mind always says no." I've learned that when people take the time to process the idea they will be able to give a more reasonable response, so I'm now more patient with the initial "no" response. In fact, I have one colleague who immediately says "no" to every one of my ideas before almost exactly one month later saying yes emphatically (and then going on to claim it as his own idea all along). It's uncanny - I have worked with him so long now that I can almost time it to the day when he will agree with my idea and claim it as his own idea all along. It used to really bother me, but not anymore - as long we get things done I don't care who "owns" the idea.

youlost_thegame 15y ago

I feel you, I also have this little voice that shouts "NO!" inside my head during meetings. But I've learned to say "I don't see it that way, but it's a good idea, let me think on that, please", which has won me a lot of respect. Even if my final answer is negative, the fact that I took some time to consider it is perceived as very positive by coworkers and managers.

einhverfr 15y ago
There's another tactic too... one I use frequently for better or worse. So I see someone who says something I don't entirely agree with but I want to see where they are coming from. I start arguing with them, asking the harder questions, pointing out things I see as problems, not to push back or prove that I am right, but to prove the merit of their ideas. Sometimes I will say something to indicate why I am doing it, but for people who know me, I usually skip that part. The goal is then to argue, hash things out, force people to defend their ideas, and then what's left after that session can be assumed to be better than any of us could have come up with otherwise and we go forward on it. However, there are two secrets to making this work: 1) You have to be known for actually using the ideas that are effectively defended. People need to know it's not personal and that it is both professional and empowering to them. If I argue with your idea, it is because I see potential value in it but I want to make sure it doesn't easily collapse. In some cases I will offer to stand aside remaining objections or in some cases, I will endorse the idea. 2) You have to be open to (and appreciate) everyone else doing the same to you. The point here is that it is a vetting process, and my ideas can be challenged just like everyone else's. In fact if you challenge my ideas, that's again a sign of respect. If you didn't value the ideas, you'd probably ignore them or (if they go against your stakes in the project) argue instead that they are dangerous or problematic. Being argumentative, like being defiant, is a powerful tool, used right. It just takes some time and effort to make sure that it is used right instead of being used in a way that is destructive.
- r00fus 15y ago
  So this is the "trial-by-fire" approach. I inadvertently use it a lot as well. I'm trying to soften the approach however. However, you can also wrap that in a friendly approach as youlost_thegame mentions - simply acknowledge the potential of the idea first (ie, positive energy) then go in with the tough questions. I find even with friends and close colleagues, if I stick to the "nice first, then difficult questions combined with enthusiasm", I can often critique the idea while making the entire conversation positive. Often the faulty idea gets discarded by it's owner after consideration.