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>BART is unique in that historically it paid most of its costs in farebox revenue. Because it's expensive as hell, and the only sane option for commuting into

>BART is unique in that historically it paid most of its costs in farebox revenue. Because it's expensive as hell, and the only sane option for commuting into the city during rush hour. A $10 round trip to go 5 miles from the east bay to downtown is absolutely crazy. Easily double the price of any other metro in the US.

throwawaymaths 3y ago
Easily an order of magnitude more than Singapore.
ghaff 3y ago
Not if you compare to commuter rail. I'm further out but if you look at commuter rail parking, the train itself, and subway if I need to take it, I'm $35 to commute into Boston for the day. (If I do it every day, the pass is a bit cheaper.) Yes, if I don't need to park at the subway and don't need to take commuter rail, it's about $5 but that's not really the norm for a lot of people coming in from the suburbs.
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- throwaway2037 3y ago
  I'm $35 to commute into Boston for the day Jesus! Between what stations? That is a crazy fare.
  - ghaff 3y ago
    Commuter rail from N. Leominster to Porter is 24.50 round-trip + $4 for parking + ~$5 round-trip for the T. That's still cheaper than driving in for a day which would be about $50 round trip using IRS rates plus parking which could easily be $30+. (I'll drive in the evening or weekend when driving/parking are easier/quicker and the commuter rail really isn't very practical for an evening event.)
    - throwaway2037 3y ago
      Excellent follow-up. Well said!
giantrobot 3y ago
Compared to the cost of driving that five miles, parking, tolls, etc that's not that expensive. If you're taking BART to work and back every work day that's $200 a month. The Bay Bridge toll is $7 IIRC. Then you've got to find parking in downtown SF. Street parking is a crap shoot in 1) finding a spot and 2) not having your car vandalized any given day and a paid lot of space is likely to put you over the $10 round trip BART cost. San Francisco seemingly hates car commuters and just about every aspect of the city demonstrates that fact. Commuting on BART for work is downright cheap compared to driving.
throwaway2037 3y ago
I like when people complain about metro fares. What would the equivalent cost (and speed!) of driving be? Remember that you will need to pay for parking. The answer: Much more than 10 USD, and much longer than BART. Also, I checked the fare between Powell Station and 12th / Oakland, it is 3.85 USD one way. So, 7.70 USD round trip. Crossing the bay twice at 100 km/h is pretty cheap at that price.
- mint2 3y ago
  Well the bay bridge toll is $7 heading to sf, and the trip probably costs over $3 of wear + fuel for the vehicle

throwawaymaths 3y ago

Easily an order of magnitude more than Singapore.

ghaff 3y ago

Not if you compare to commuter rail. I'm further out but if you look at commuter rail parking, the train itself, and subway if I need to take it, I'm $35 to commute into Boston for the day. (If I do it every day, the pass is a bit cheaper.) Yes, if I don't need to park at the subway and don't need to take commuter rail, it's about $5 but that's not really the norm for a lot of people coming in from the suburbs.

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throwaway2037 3y ago
I'm $35 to commute into Boston for the day Jesus! Between what stations? That is a crazy fare.
- ghaff 3y ago
  Commuter rail from N. Leominster to Porter is 24.50 round-trip + $4 for parking + ~$5 round-trip for the T. That's still cheaper than driving in for a day which would be about $50 round trip using IRS rates plus parking which could easily be $30+. (I'll drive in the evening or weekend when driving/parking are easier/quicker and the commuter rail really isn't very practical for an evening event.)
  - throwaway2037 3y ago
    Excellent follow-up. Well said!

giantrobot 3y ago

Compared to the cost of driving that five miles, parking, tolls, etc that's not that expensive. If you're taking BART to work and back every work day that's $200 a month. The Bay Bridge toll is $7 IIRC. Then you've got to find parking in downtown SF. Street parking is a crap shoot in 1) finding a spot and 2) not having your car vandalized any given day and a paid lot of space is likely to put you over the $10 round trip BART cost. San Francisco seemingly hates car commuters and just about every aspect of the city demonstrates that fact. Commuting on BART for work is downright cheap compared to driving.

throwaway2037 3y ago

I like when people complain about metro fares. What would the equivalent cost (and speed!) of driving be? Remember that you will need to pay for parking. The answer: Much more than 10 USD, and much longer than BART. Also, I checked the fare between Powell Station and 12th / Oakland, it is 3.85 USD one way. So, 7.70 USD round trip. Crossing the bay twice at 100 km/h is pretty cheap at that price.

mint2 3y ago
Well the bay bridge toll is $7 heading to sf, and the trip probably costs over $3 of wear + fuel for the vehicle