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For similarly silly ideas: see these articles https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-oriented_ontology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-oriented_ontology ht
by Der_Einzige 3y ago
For similarly silly ideas: see these articles
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-oriented_ontology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-oriented_ontology
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speculative_realism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speculative_realism
- DontchaKnowit 3y agoI cant even find anything resembling an explanation if what "speculative realism" posits in that wiki article. What is it and why is it silly?
- Der_Einzige 3y ago"Thus, all object relations, human and nonhuman, are said to exist on an equal ontological footing with one another" They are ideas from people who don't like Anthropocenterism, which Integrated Information Theory is also opposed to. It's worth noting that all of the people who believe in any of this are philosophical wingcucks like Nick Land.
- WFHRenaissance 3y agoLOL Chill with the Land hate.
- Der_Einzige 3y agoHe's openly fascist and a charlatan. I shouldn't be surprised that people here like him. Also no surprise that people influenced by him, i.e. Mark Fischer, killed themselves.
- DontchaKnowit 3y agookay I must say - I just read his wikipedia and I read a line saying he was explicitly racist - skimmed all the sources and there was 0 evidence of racism. Then i read his article : Hyper-Racism. It is not racist, as far as I can tell. Can you hook me up with something damning about him? cause to me, he just seems like a mega autistic edge-lord philosopher that has some fairly prescient views about what the future is going to look like. (and Steve Bannon happens to like him, so people call him racist) EDIT : sorry misread your comment - you said fascist, not racist. Anyway I am going to keep my above comment cause I'm interested
- Der_Einzige 3y agoRead his essay "Dark Enlightenment". Again, he is openly fascist, even if he says he's not. It's a meme for actual fascists to claim they aren't. "Land disputes the similarity between his ideas and fascism, claiming that "Fascism is a mass anti-capitalist movement,"[4] whereas he prefers that "[capitalist] corporate power should become the organizing force in society." Okay nick, you're an idiot and never actually looked at how fascist societies, like fascist italy were organized. They were "Corportist" and ruthlessly capitalistic and even hitler only included the "socialism" part of national socialism to appease the masses. Hitler and his regime were not socialist, and if he were, he never would have secured the support of big business. See the fascist section of these articles if you don't believe me: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mefo_bills https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mefo_bills https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secret_Meeting_of_20_February_1933 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secret_Meeting_of_20_February_... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freundeskreis_der_Wirtschaft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freundeskreis_der_Wirtschaft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrielleneingabe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrielleneingabe
- DontchaKnowit 3y agoappreciate the info! I'll read up on it.
- DontchaKnowit 3y agoI understood basically 0 of this.
- mrtranscendence 3y agoI don't think IIT is a correct theory or even on the right track. Nevertheless I fail to see how it's "silly". It's no sillier than any other putative scientific theory of consciousness -- less silly, since IIT actually makes a testable prediction.
- goatlover 3y agoI don't see what makes them silly. Metaphysics is hard, and speculative realism is a proposed answer to modern transcendental idealism stemming from Kant, where the worry is that we can't say objective things about the world independent of human thought. Things like dinosaurs existing before humans evolved is seen as correlated to our experiences with fossils in the ground, and not an objective truth about the universe. Speculative realism is a way around that while respecting the philosophical arguments of the Kantians.
- mannykannot 3y agoOur mental experiences seem to be subjective, so what prospect is there of making any objective statement about the world if correlations are inadequate for the purpose?
- goatlover 3y agoI think the argument is that it can't just be correlations because then we get stuck in the framework of the world looks as if things were going on before humans existed without being able to say that's true. Realists want to be able to say there are fossils in the ground because dinosaurs really did exist before us and not just that it appears that way to humans. Thus the speculative part of how to define reality in a way that isn't just correlated to our experiences.