5 ms·

I sleep well at night. I can't speak for all of high tech, but my experience was that we encrypted everything on the phy itself. All data was encrypted via har

I sleep well at night. I can't speak for all of high tech, but my experience was that we encrypted everything on the phy itself. All data was encrypted via hardware before it left the host and was never decrypted until it reached its endpoint. If the endpoint was one of our devices, it was again decrypted in hardware. Outside of this, I don't expect Google, fb, etc to ignore court subpoenas. That is not a tech issue, it's a government one (if there is really any issue at all).

EA-3167 3y ago
Plus for all of the MANY years of hand-wringing and doomsaying, the slippery slope never seems to appear.
- FollowingTheDao 3y ago
  It is here, right now. They are actively collecting this data as using it extra judicially to convict people of crimes. You feel fine about all this because it does not affect you. Yet. And the person who you are responding to is encrypting everything, which google, facebook ,et all are not doing.
  - EA-3167 3y ago
    I'd love some examples of these "extra judicial" convictions, and as I said I'm tired of the "yet" argument. I've been hearing this my whole life, as though the government never monitored pre-internet communications. And as far as active collection, how does that compare to people happily and eagerly sharing every aspect of their lives on FB?
  - gretch 3y ago
    Disclosure: work in big tech. > It is here, right now. You should know that this type of argument is likely to hurt your own position when delivered to a moderate middle. You're basically telling people to ignore what they see and hear around them, and to believe that not only is the end coming - it has already come and we are living in a dystopia. The reality I see when I go outside is that me and my neighbors and my community is doing fine. Is there problems? Sure there are, as there always was and always will be. But no my friend, we are not at the bottom of a slippery slope. From what I see there's way more problematic extra-judicial action that has zero to do with big tech - cops just shooting people in the streets over minor infractions... that's where I spend my activist hours.
    - giraffe_lady 3y ago
      These things are straightforwardly related though. It is very common among people who organized or were very active in summer 2020 anti-police violence protests to have caught charges in the last few years for completely unrelated things. Often very "routine" type harassment, fraud, low level drug stuff that would normally not ever be investigated without getting busted or reported. Of course that's all benign coincidence I'm sure I'm just being paranoid. And of course your neighbors and community are doing fine, I'm sure mine are just more criminal. Nothing to worry about keep working on your thing.
      - gretch 3y ago
        > . It is very common among people who organized or were very active in summer 2020 anti-police violence protests to have caught charges in the last few years for completely unrelated things. I participated in these protests, as did many of my friends and community. Nothing happened to them such as you describe. So no, I don't believe you.
        giraffe_lady 3y ago
        Oh, well ok then.
        wahnfrieden 3y ago
        you can just look at the news coming out of atlanta right now.
        uoaei 3y ago
        Wondering what makes you think your belief, experience, or recounting of either (truthful or otherwise) would be credible enough to be worth enunciating. I could just as easily say I had a bunch of friends who were targeted. I could tell you I spent time at a black site held by feds who wouldn't identify themselves or their agency. So obviously anecdotes here in this context carry no value. What is more believable and trustworthy is the investigative reporting that clearly states that what giraffe_lady et al. have been saying is closer to the truth than your tiny (and statistically probably white and/or middle-to-upper class, considering you have an account here -- obviously not a threat to the status quo and so quite low on the list of targets for state-sanctioned kidnapping) bubble's experience, faithfully represented or otherwise. I guess what I'm saying is basically what ends up being the appropriate response to the problem always on this site: you don't know the extent of what you don't know, so more than a little humility is warranted here, particularly in the face of real reporting by real journalists.
  - deelowe 3y ago
    Via subpoena. What is the issue again?
- beambot 3y ago
  Conveniently ignoring parallel construction? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_construction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_construction
  - willcipriano 3y ago
    The thing I've noticed about slippery slopes is the goal posts are also on the slope.
  - EA-3167 3y ago
    That's not a very impressive article, and it seems like it's a practice that greatly predates modern communication infrastructure.
    - beambot 3y ago
      TLDR: Your rights are routinely violated in a "slippery slope" manner, but the methods and incidents cannot be rectified by the courts because it's hiding under a veneer of parallel construction. It's not like law enforcement is going to come out and say "We're violating your rights." Snowden revelations are a prominent example; Clearview's facial recognition database is another: "Clearview AI used nearly 1m times by US police" https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-65057011 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-65057011
- vitehozonage 3y ago
  What do you mean? Sarcasm? It's already worse than 1984, further down the slope than people's nightmares used to be
  - EA-3167 3y ago
    I mean this without a shred of disrespect: have you read 1984?
    - salawat 3y ago
      The lack of the several minute rage, and complete lack of ministry of love and truth being named as such does not change the fact that all you need to do is look hard enough, and the level of duplicity in saying one thing but doing another, and disguising it through legalistic doublespeak is rampant. For someone who was around before all of this connectivity became possible, the speed with which the primitives to realize so many of these authorial worst case scenarios possible are being converged upon by a society already explicitly aware of what to look out for is frankly horrifying.
      - EA-3167 3y ago
        > The lack of the several minute rage, and complete lack of ministry of love and truth being named as such does not change the fact that all you need to do is look hard enough, and the level of duplicity in saying one thing but doing another, and disguising it through legalistic doublespeak is rampant. That's all of human history, not some new development, and hardly the core of 1984. There is no state control of speech and thought, no enforced caste system, no eternal war, no thought police. This sort of histrionic posting is why "literally 1984" has become a meme mocking the people who say it.
    - vitehozonage 3y ago
      Yes. It is a different world than ours obviously, but it warned of a myriad of horrors, most of which have already been exceeded in my view. That's my genuine viewpoint. For example, one of the most chilling aspects was the telescreen to me. The horror of telescreens was that someone could maybe be watching, even in your own home. Quote: "There was of course no way of knowing whether you were being watched at any given moment". Now this has been exceeded by technological mass surveillance - basically we ARE being watched nonstop. A panopticon effect is replaced by a robot sitting and staring 24/7. Everything I say is stored forever; further, machine learning can effectively filter through all of our civilisation's data and, even far in the future when attitudes change, red flag anything I say which is deemed unacceptable. Pegasus malware can turn my smartphone into a listening and viewing device at any time. I can barely even use cash in my country anymore, so this is extending to all purchases. This is BEYOND what Orwell could envision. It is shocking that people have somehow come to accept and normalise this feeling of being watched. I could go on and refer to hundreds of similar aspects.

EA-3167 3y ago

Plus for all of the MANY years of hand-wringing and doomsaying, the slippery slope never seems to appear.

FollowingTheDao 3y ago
It is here, right now. They are actively collecting this data as using it extra judicially to convict people of crimes. You feel fine about all this because it does not affect you. Yet. And the person who you are responding to is encrypting everything, which google, facebook ,et all are not doing.
- EA-3167 3y ago
  I'd love some examples of these "extra judicial" convictions, and as I said I'm tired of the "yet" argument. I've been hearing this my whole life, as though the government never monitored pre-internet communications. And as far as active collection, how does that compare to people happily and eagerly sharing every aspect of their lives on FB?
- gretch 3y ago
  Disclosure: work in big tech. > It is here, right now. You should know that this type of argument is likely to hurt your own position when delivered to a moderate middle. You're basically telling people to ignore what they see and hear around them, and to believe that not only is the end coming - it has already come and we are living in a dystopia. The reality I see when I go outside is that me and my neighbors and my community is doing fine. Is there problems? Sure there are, as there always was and always will be. But no my friend, we are not at the bottom of a slippery slope. From what I see there's way more problematic extra-judicial action that has zero to do with big tech - cops just shooting people in the streets over minor infractions... that's where I spend my activist hours.
  - giraffe_lady 3y ago
    These things are straightforwardly related though. It is very common among people who organized or were very active in summer 2020 anti-police violence protests to have caught charges in the last few years for completely unrelated things. Often very "routine" type harassment, fraud, low level drug stuff that would normally not ever be investigated without getting busted or reported. Of course that's all benign coincidence I'm sure I'm just being paranoid. And of course your neighbors and community are doing fine, I'm sure mine are just more criminal. Nothing to worry about keep working on your thing.
    - gretch 3y ago
      > . It is very common among people who organized or were very active in summer 2020 anti-police violence protests to have caught charges in the last few years for completely unrelated things. I participated in these protests, as did many of my friends and community. Nothing happened to them such as you describe. So no, I don't believe you.
      - giraffe_lady 3y ago
        Oh, well ok then.
      - wahnfrieden 3y ago
        you can just look at the news coming out of atlanta right now.
      - uoaei 3y ago
        Wondering what makes you think your belief, experience, or recounting of either (truthful or otherwise) would be credible enough to be worth enunciating. I could just as easily say I had a bunch of friends who were targeted. I could tell you I spent time at a black site held by feds who wouldn't identify themselves or their agency. So obviously anecdotes here in this context carry no value. What is more believable and trustworthy is the investigative reporting that clearly states that what giraffe_lady et al. have been saying is closer to the truth than your tiny (and statistically probably white and/or middle-to-upper class, considering you have an account here -- obviously not a threat to the status quo and so quite low on the list of targets for state-sanctioned kidnapping) bubble's experience, faithfully represented or otherwise. I guess what I'm saying is basically what ends up being the appropriate response to the problem always on this site: you don't know the extent of what you don't know, so more than a little humility is warranted here, particularly in the face of real reporting by real journalists.
- deelowe 3y ago
  Via subpoena. What is the issue again?
beambot 3y ago
Conveniently ignoring parallel construction? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_construction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_construction
- willcipriano 3y ago
  The thing I've noticed about slippery slopes is the goal posts are also on the slope.
- EA-3167 3y ago
  That's not a very impressive article, and it seems like it's a practice that greatly predates modern communication infrastructure.
  - beambot 3y ago
    TLDR: Your rights are routinely violated in a "slippery slope" manner, but the methods and incidents cannot be rectified by the courts because it's hiding under a veneer of parallel construction. It's not like law enforcement is going to come out and say "We're violating your rights." Snowden revelations are a prominent example; Clearview's facial recognition database is another: "Clearview AI used nearly 1m times by US police" https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-65057011 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-65057011
vitehozonage 3y ago
What do you mean? Sarcasm? It's already worse than 1984, further down the slope than people's nightmares used to be
- EA-3167 3y ago
  I mean this without a shred of disrespect: have you read 1984?
  - salawat 3y ago
    The lack of the several minute rage, and complete lack of ministry of love and truth being named as such does not change the fact that all you need to do is look hard enough, and the level of duplicity in saying one thing but doing another, and disguising it through legalistic doublespeak is rampant. For someone who was around before all of this connectivity became possible, the speed with which the primitives to realize so many of these authorial worst case scenarios possible are being converged upon by a society already explicitly aware of what to look out for is frankly horrifying.
    - EA-3167 3y ago
      > The lack of the several minute rage, and complete lack of ministry of love and truth being named as such does not change the fact that all you need to do is look hard enough, and the level of duplicity in saying one thing but doing another, and disguising it through legalistic doublespeak is rampant. That's all of human history, not some new development, and hardly the core of 1984. There is no state control of speech and thought, no enforced caste system, no eternal war, no thought police. This sort of histrionic posting is why "literally 1984" has become a meme mocking the people who say it.
  - vitehozonage 3y ago
    Yes. It is a different world than ours obviously, but it warned of a myriad of horrors, most of which have already been exceeded in my view. That's my genuine viewpoint. For example, one of the most chilling aspects was the telescreen to me. The horror of telescreens was that someone could maybe be watching, even in your own home. Quote: "There was of course no way of knowing whether you were being watched at any given moment". Now this has been exceeded by technological mass surveillance - basically we ARE being watched nonstop. A panopticon effect is replaced by a robot sitting and staring 24/7. Everything I say is stored forever; further, machine learning can effectively filter through all of our civilisation's data and, even far in the future when attitudes change, red flag anything I say which is deemed unacceptable. Pegasus malware can turn my smartphone into a listening and viewing device at any time. I can barely even use cash in my country anymore, so this is extending to all purchases. This is BEYOND what Orwell could envision. It is shocking that people have somehow come to accept and normalise this feeling of being watched. I could go on and refer to hundreds of similar aspects.