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I have similarly low electric bills for much of the year by way of solar panels and Powerwalls. The solar power is enough to power the whole house (with all ele

by nnf 3y ago

I have similarly low electric bills for much of the year by way of solar panels and Powerwalls. The solar power is enough to power the whole house (with all electric HVAC & appliances, and no natural gas), charge the batteries, charge the car, and export the excess to the grid. Most nights the batteries supply enough power to make it through the night, even with the A/C or heat running intermittently. Only when the batteries are drained to their reserve limit do we have to import electricity from the grid, which we sometimes go for days without having to do.

bzzzt 3y ago
So your 'easy step' is to live in a place where this is possible? Is the entire world welcome to live next to you?
- nnf 3y ago
  I’m not the GP, I was just pitching in to answer the question about how electric bills can be that low.
- friend_and_foe 3y ago
  Not who youre responding to (but probably who you thought you were responding to) but where I live is not Hawaii or the pacific northwest, it's not all roses. It gets hot and it gets cold, not Montana cold and not Arizona hot but still a bit extreme. And very, very humid. There's always a reason to say you can't do it, but I do what I can and if it's important to you you can too. It's a change in habit and lifestyle, that's all. Live lighter and don't rely on comfort like you'll die without it.
  - bzzzt 3y ago
    > Live lighter and don't rely on comfort like you'll die without it. While for some people it's a comfort issue there are lots of people that will literally die without cooling during heatwaves. Besides that, you can't expect people to be productive (especially in jobs where you're supposed to make use of your brain) when they are slowly cooked in a hot office.
    - spicymapotofu 3y ago
      Brain work is the most privileged about working conditions, imagine how many kitchen workers would drop dead from hwat exhaustion if their managers weren't freezing them towels every summer.
    - friend_and_foe 3y ago
      Sure, I don't expect everyone to be like me. I know not everyone can. But everyone lived without air conditioning for all of human history until about a hundred years ago. The number of people who will die without it is much less than you'd think, and there are ways to keep cool without it that people used when they build houses, public buildings etc before air conditioning.
vel0city 3y ago
What was the upfront cost for your setup? If it costs me $20k to get the solar panels + battery set up and they're good for ~15-20 years, its not really a $2/mo power bill. Amortizing the $20k over 20 years that's still just under $84/mo for the hardware. If it only lasts me 15 years its ~$111/mo. And that's assuming I had all the cash on hand at the time to install the system and didn't need to take out a loan. If I had to finance half of that ($10k), at 6% APR over that 20 years that's $71/mo for just the financed half and adding that $10k amortized is another $41.66 for a total of ~$112/mo. But hey my power bill is only $2/mo!
- nnf 3y ago
  It was way more than $20k, but I didn’t do it for the cost savings. If I remember right, the panels are warranted for 20 years and are supposed to last at least 25, and I think the batteries are guaranteed for 10 years. The batteries are so expensive that they pretty much throw cost savings out the window, but it’s very nice having the added resilience to power outages, as well as knowing we can run the A/C and charge the car (especially at night) without causing our local utility to burn more coal. I’m not under any delusions that my solar panels are going to save the world, but at the same time I think it’s important that we all do what we can while we expend our efforts in other ways too (voting, petitioning local governments and utilities to allow and incentivize more solar, etc.) that will have a much bigger effect if successful. I also like setting an example for the people around me. Since adding solar, we’ve had several neighbors and family members ask about it, and two so far have added solar themselves. I of course don’t know, but I like to think I may have at least nudged them in the right direction when they decided to add solar to their own houses.

by nnf 3y ago

bzzzt 3y ago

So your 'easy step' is to live in a place where this is possible? Is the entire world welcome to live next to you?

nnf 3y ago
I’m not the GP, I was just pitching in to answer the question about how electric bills can be that low.
friend_and_foe 3y ago
Not who youre responding to (but probably who you thought you were responding to) but where I live is not Hawaii or the pacific northwest, it's not all roses. It gets hot and it gets cold, not Montana cold and not Arizona hot but still a bit extreme. And very, very humid. There's always a reason to say you can't do it, but I do what I can and if it's important to you you can too. It's a change in habit and lifestyle, that's all. Live lighter and don't rely on comfort like you'll die without it.
- bzzzt 3y ago
  > Live lighter and don't rely on comfort like you'll die without it. While for some people it's a comfort issue there are lots of people that will literally die without cooling during heatwaves. Besides that, you can't expect people to be productive (especially in jobs where you're supposed to make use of your brain) when they are slowly cooked in a hot office.
  - spicymapotofu 3y ago
    Brain work is the most privileged about working conditions, imagine how many kitchen workers would drop dead from hwat exhaustion if their managers weren't freezing them towels every summer.
  - friend_and_foe 3y ago
    Sure, I don't expect everyone to be like me. I know not everyone can. But everyone lived without air conditioning for all of human history until about a hundred years ago. The number of people who will die without it is much less than you'd think, and there are ways to keep cool without it that people used when they build houses, public buildings etc before air conditioning.

vel0city 3y ago

What was the upfront cost for your setup? If it costs me $20k to get the solar panels + battery set up and they're good for ~15-20 years, its not really a $2/mo power bill. Amortizing the $20k over 20 years that's still just under $84/mo for the hardware. If it only lasts me 15 years its ~$111/mo. And that's assuming I had all the cash on hand at the time to install the system and didn't need to take out a loan. If I had to finance half of that ($10k), at 6% APR over that 20 years that's $71/mo for just the financed half and adding that $10k amortized is another $41.66 for a total of ~$112/mo. But hey my power bill is only $2/mo!

nnf 3y ago
It was way more than $20k, but I didn’t do it for the cost savings. If I remember right, the panels are warranted for 20 years and are supposed to last at least 25, and I think the batteries are guaranteed for 10 years. The batteries are so expensive that they pretty much throw cost savings out the window, but it’s very nice having the added resilience to power outages, as well as knowing we can run the A/C and charge the car (especially at night) without causing our local utility to burn more coal. I’m not under any delusions that my solar panels are going to save the world, but at the same time I think it’s important that we all do what we can while we expend our efforts in other ways too (voting, petitioning local governments and utilities to allow and incentivize more solar, etc.) that will have a much bigger effect if successful. I also like setting an example for the people around me. Since adding solar, we’ve had several neighbors and family members ask about it, and two so far have added solar themselves. I of course don’t know, but I like to think I may have at least nudged them in the right direction when they decided to add solar to their own houses.