9 ms·

Battery throttling doesn’t fit the rest of these. Preventing a device reboot is pro consumer.

by basch 3y ago

015a 3y ago
Ah, found that "heated discussion" the OP mentioned.
- darkhelmet 3y ago
  Heh. I can't blame them for doing this, but not telling people what's happening (and why) was the big mistake. People generally want their gadgets to be as lightweight as possible, cheap as possible, last as long as possible, and be reliable. There's tradeoffs in balancing those. eg: overbuilding the battery to make the device run longer in the face of degradation adds weight, size, and cost. Somebody has to make a call on where the balance should be. What nobody really talks about in the context of device longevity is wear levels in the onboard flash. A battery replacement or three doesn't extend that clock. It's pretty good but it doesn't last forever. This is more of an issue on devices with smaller amounts of flash storage with a lot more storage churn.
- rootusrootus 3y ago
  One nice thing HN has taught me is that I should be wary of anti-Apple claims like this. Inevitably someone comes along to add context or explain what's actually going on, and 9 times out of 10 it turns out that Apple's solution wasn't unreasonable at all. Which isn't to say that things like the 30% app store cut is entirely defensible, though you can certainly make some halfway plausible claims in that direction (based mostly on how retail works, especially at the time iPhones were invented). Or sideloading. There are legitimate gripes. But a lot of crap spewed regularly on HN turns out to be exactly that, crap.
  - downWidOutaFite 3y ago
    You can always find a reason to defend any feature. In the case of this article you could say it's more seamless to open Outlook links in their browser. And that's exactly what Microsoft's PR says. But for some reason Apple's fans are way more insistent in defending everything and sticking to the PR department's arguments. No criticism is allowed to stand.
    - rootusrootus 3y ago
      I find that more often than not, the anti-fans are more strident these days than the fans are. What I like is that there are some knowledgeable fans here on HN that don't just retort with "nuh-uh!" whenever a critic levels some sort of unfounded conspiracy theory at Apple, but actually explain what is going on. They provide context, documentation, and important details that seem to get lost when the only discussion is emotional. HN isn't perfect, but it's so much better than a lot of other online discussion forums these days.
flagrant_taco 3y ago
Shipping a device that will overheat and reboot when the device is a couple years old and fixing it by silently throttling the device isn't pro consumer either Those devices really should have been recalled or offered a generous trade-in value to account for the fundamental design flaw
- soraminazuki 3y ago
  So that's every device with rechargeable batteries then.
  - flagrant_taco 3y ago
    Not really, most devices are designed with a commination of passive and active cooling as needed to operate under normal conditions. Apple just has a history of prioritizing design asthenic and they're willing to push the limits on thermal regulation.
    - soraminazuki 3y ago
      > most devices are designed with a commination of passive and active cooling Smartphones with active cooling? You must live in world that's very different from the one I live in. Also, as mentioned in other replies, your whole point about "overheating and rebooting" is a straw man. Throttling was introduced to address battery aging. Again, a problem that affects every device with rechargeable batteries. > Apple just has a history of prioritizing design asthenic and they're willing to push the limits on thermal regulation. Except they do have thermal controls...
- scarface_74 3y ago
  Have you found a new battery technology where that is mid the case?
  - flagrant_taco 3y ago
    Device design is always constrained by the current technology. It isn't impossible to make a phone with current battery tech that doesn't overheat after a year or two of normal use Apple just pushed design to far and underestimated the cooling/heat dissipation required
babypuncher 3y ago
Agreed, the problem was how poorly this was communicated to the user. I'd much rather have a slow phone than a phone that doesn't work at all (or worse, bursts into flames in my pocket)

Battery throttling doesn’t fit the rest of these. Preventing a device reboot is pro consumer.

by basch 3y ago

Battery throttling doesn’t fit the rest of these. Preventing a device reboot is pro consumer.

015a 3y ago

Ah, found that "heated discussion" the OP mentioned.

darkhelmet 3y ago
Heh. I can't blame them for doing this, but not telling people what's happening (and why) was the big mistake. People generally want their gadgets to be as lightweight as possible, cheap as possible, last as long as possible, and be reliable. There's tradeoffs in balancing those. eg: overbuilding the battery to make the device run longer in the face of degradation adds weight, size, and cost. Somebody has to make a call on where the balance should be. What nobody really talks about in the context of device longevity is wear levels in the onboard flash. A battery replacement or three doesn't extend that clock. It's pretty good but it doesn't last forever. This is more of an issue on devices with smaller amounts of flash storage with a lot more storage churn.
rootusrootus 3y ago
One nice thing HN has taught me is that I should be wary of anti-Apple claims like this. Inevitably someone comes along to add context or explain what's actually going on, and 9 times out of 10 it turns out that Apple's solution wasn't unreasonable at all. Which isn't to say that things like the 30% app store cut is entirely defensible, though you can certainly make some halfway plausible claims in that direction (based mostly on how retail works, especially at the time iPhones were invented). Or sideloading. There are legitimate gripes. But a lot of crap spewed regularly on HN turns out to be exactly that, crap.
- downWidOutaFite 3y ago
  You can always find a reason to defend any feature. In the case of this article you could say it's more seamless to open Outlook links in their browser. And that's exactly what Microsoft's PR says. But for some reason Apple's fans are way more insistent in defending everything and sticking to the PR department's arguments. No criticism is allowed to stand.
  - rootusrootus 3y ago
    I find that more often than not, the anti-fans are more strident these days than the fans are. What I like is that there are some knowledgeable fans here on HN that don't just retort with "nuh-uh!" whenever a critic levels some sort of unfounded conspiracy theory at Apple, but actually explain what is going on. They provide context, documentation, and important details that seem to get lost when the only discussion is emotional. HN isn't perfect, but it's so much better than a lot of other online discussion forums these days.

flagrant_taco 3y ago

Shipping a device that will overheat and reboot when the device is a couple years old and fixing it by silently throttling the device isn't pro consumer either Those devices really should have been recalled or offered a generous trade-in value to account for the fundamental design flaw

soraminazuki 3y ago
So that's every device with rechargeable batteries then.
- flagrant_taco 3y ago
  Not really, most devices are designed with a commination of passive and active cooling as needed to operate under normal conditions. Apple just has a history of prioritizing design asthenic and they're willing to push the limits on thermal regulation.
  - soraminazuki 3y ago
    > most devices are designed with a commination of passive and active cooling Smartphones with active cooling? You must live in world that's very different from the one I live in. Also, as mentioned in other replies, your whole point about "overheating and rebooting" is a straw man. Throttling was introduced to address battery aging. Again, a problem that affects every device with rechargeable batteries. > Apple just has a history of prioritizing design asthenic and they're willing to push the limits on thermal regulation. Except they do have thermal controls...
scarface_74 3y ago
Have you found a new battery technology where that is mid the case?
- flagrant_taco 3y ago
  Device design is always constrained by the current technology. It isn't impossible to make a phone with current battery tech that doesn't overheat after a year or two of normal use Apple just pushed design to far and underestimated the cooling/heat dissipation required

babypuncher 3y ago

Agreed, the problem was how poorly this was communicated to the user. I'd much rather have a slow phone than a phone that doesn't work at all (or worse, bursts into flames in my pocket)