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> literally almost everyone used to be anti or neutral about LGBT 20 years ago I can't remember any mocking for changes on LGBT issues from "anti" to "support"

by ke88y 3y ago

> literally almost everyone used to be anti or neutral about LGBT 20 years ago I can't remember any mocking for changes on LGBT issues from "anti" to "support". In fact, that movement was particularly careful throughout the naughts and 10s to be welcoming to changed minds. I don't remember any mocking for changes in the other direction either, but tbh that direction of change was probably pretty rare until fairly recently. So maybe it did happen and I never saw it because the precondition was rare. Nit: Massachusetts legalized gay marriage in 2004, which was 20 years ago. Several other states quickly followed. Major changes to civil institutions don't happen when "almost everyone" is quixotic. I think you could say "a majority" were anti or neutral, but certainly not "literally almost everyone". Perhaps "literally almost everyone running for President", but now we're talking about dozens or perhaps hundreds of people most of whom genuinely deserve to be mocked for having no real convictions outside of personal ambition. Or at the very least mocked a bit for the obvious dearth of courage to defend or even admit to any convictions they do hold which happen to be inconvenient to electoral college math...

darklycan51 3y ago
That's why I said both anti and neutral, yes it is true that most were "neutral" but there were also a lot of lowkey insults aimed at the LGBT community, such as casual use of the f word, let's not pretend that wasn't the case
actuallyalys 3y ago
Off-hand the only situation where I remember people being mocked for switching positions toward favoring gay marriage is politicians, such as in a Matthew Bors comic [0]. But politicians are widely perceived to change their public stances for insincere reasons, so this example suggests that it’s insincerity, not changing positions, that people tend to mock. [0]: https://thenib.com/the-gay-marriage-rush/ https://thenib.com/the-gay-marriage-rush/
jfengel 3y ago
I can think of one example where somebody was publicly mocked for their change of heart: Rob Portman, who changed his mind about gay marriage after his son came out. The vast majority of the coverage was positive, for exactly the reason you said. But I heard a number of voices who saw it as part of a pattern: they were uninterested in any issue that did not affect them personally. It's not a lack of conviction, but rather a lack of empathy. Every issue is pursued with equal self-interest, holding back rights from everybody else until it serves them.

by ke88y 3y ago

darklycan51 3y ago

That's why I said both anti and neutral, yes it is true that most were "neutral" but there were also a lot of lowkey insults aimed at the LGBT community, such as casual use of the f word, let's not pretend that wasn't the case

actuallyalys 3y ago

Off-hand the only situation where I remember people being mocked for switching positions toward favoring gay marriage is politicians, such as in a Matthew Bors comic [0]. But politicians are widely perceived to change their public stances for insincere reasons, so this example suggests that it’s insincerity, not changing positions, that people tend to mock. [0]: https://thenib.com/the-gay-marriage-rush/ https://thenib.com/the-gay-marriage-rush/

jfengel 3y ago

I can think of one example where somebody was publicly mocked for their change of heart: Rob Portman, who changed his mind about gay marriage after his son came out. The vast majority of the coverage was positive, for exactly the reason you said. But I heard a number of voices who saw it as part of a pattern: they were uninterested in any issue that did not affect them personally. It's not a lack of conviction, but rather a lack of empathy. Every issue is pursued with equal self-interest, holding back rights from everybody else until it serves them.