6 ms·

First skiing, now this -- you'd think Apple would get their act together and come up with a better solution than "turn it off"

M4v3R 3y ago
It also got triggered on roller coasters: https://www.macrumors.com/2022/10/09/iphone-14-crash-detection-on-rollercoaster/ https://www.macrumors.com/2022/10/09/iphone-14-crash-detecti...
- tempodox 3y ago
  I can believe that a roller coaster ride has similarities with a car crash, in terms of acceleration, but dancing?
  - automatic6131 3y ago
    Dancing with a phone in your hand (like an old ipod advert) absolutely.
    - zamfi 3y ago
      Or worse, a pocket: phone floats up with you as you jump, then starts to freefall, then slams hard against your rising pocket.
  - zython 3y ago
    What kind of rollercoaster ride has more than ~10-20 g forces ? I could see how "negative" g forces could lead to a false positive but I think the absolute forces are too low. On the other hand I could see how during dancing the phone gets thrown around and that may be a similar pattern to a car crash.
    - eimrine 3y ago
      > What kind of rollercoaster ride has more than ~10-20 g forces ? I suppose that a regular crash but with a lucky ending can do a significant damage to phone in the pocket, because while the body is losing speed slowly, the phone and other things in pocket can hit the road hardly and ricochet with insane acceleration. I am a fan of downhill but I never carry my phone during that kind of ride when I am acknowledged about high chances of my crash. And in that risky kind of event I would rather go bombing the hill with a friend who can give me a proper help than rely on some computer.
  - FinnKuhn 3y ago
    Maybe in a bag you are swinging around or more likely in a Moshpit (rapid acceleration with a sudden stop)
kotaKat 3y ago
To Apple's 100% credit they were willing to ship engineers out. This happened day 1 (Thursday) of a 4-day festival. Even though they declined to have Apple come out you know they still sent a couple engineers out to gather data regardless. On top of that, being proactive once it started happening and getting messaging out to attendees helped cut down the calls by ~50%, which definitely helped. All you can do is continually refine it once you deploy it. A bit damned if you do, damned if you don't.
- gdulli 3y ago
  You're not damned if you practice judgment that keeps you from using machine learning anywhere just because you can, inflicting others with the hassle of inevitable false positives, false negatives, and false sense of security in a solution that will remain flawed regardless of your own level of patience to throw new versions out.
- ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
  > All you can do is continually refine it once you deploy it. A bit damned if you do, damned if you don't you could also get it to work with fewer false positives before deploying it, so more like damned if you do rush to market without proper testing and not-damned if you're thoughtful and do minimal testing first (which would obviously include dancing) or, alternatively, just don't deploy and keep deployed a feature which fails so often and for which failures have such a significant impact on people
  - johnnyanmac 3y ago
    >you could also get it to work with fewer false positives before deploying it I'm sure they did.
    - ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
      "fewer" obviously means fewer than it has now: the amount it currently has is too many, the amount it needs to have is fewer than the amount it currently has this means they either didn't get it to work with fewer false positives than it has, or they did, then they discarded those improvements, leading to the inadequate release we have now (in which, again, the amount of false positives is too many)

M4v3R 3y ago

It also got triggered on roller coasters: https://www.macrumors.com/2022/10/09/iphone-14-crash-detection-on-rollercoaster/ https://www.macrumors.com/2022/10/09/iphone-14-crash-detecti...

tempodox 3y ago
I can believe that a roller coaster ride has similarities with a car crash, in terms of acceleration, but dancing?
- automatic6131 3y ago
  Dancing with a phone in your hand (like an old ipod advert) absolutely.
  - zamfi 3y ago
    Or worse, a pocket: phone floats up with you as you jump, then starts to freefall, then slams hard against your rising pocket.
- zython 3y ago
  What kind of rollercoaster ride has more than ~10-20 g forces ? I could see how "negative" g forces could lead to a false positive but I think the absolute forces are too low. On the other hand I could see how during dancing the phone gets thrown around and that may be a similar pattern to a car crash.
  - eimrine 3y ago
    > What kind of rollercoaster ride has more than ~10-20 g forces ? I suppose that a regular crash but with a lucky ending can do a significant damage to phone in the pocket, because while the body is losing speed slowly, the phone and other things in pocket can hit the road hardly and ricochet with insane acceleration. I am a fan of downhill but I never carry my phone during that kind of ride when I am acknowledged about high chances of my crash. And in that risky kind of event I would rather go bombing the hill with a friend who can give me a proper help than rely on some computer.
- FinnKuhn 3y ago
  Maybe in a bag you are swinging around or more likely in a Moshpit (rapid acceleration with a sudden stop)

kotaKat 3y ago

To Apple's 100% credit they were willing to ship engineers out. This happened day 1 (Thursday) of a 4-day festival. Even though they declined to have Apple come out you know they still sent a couple engineers out to gather data regardless. On top of that, being proactive once it started happening and getting messaging out to attendees helped cut down the calls by ~50%, which definitely helped. All you can do is continually refine it once you deploy it. A bit damned if you do, damned if you don't.

gdulli 3y ago
You're not damned if you practice judgment that keeps you from using machine learning anywhere just because you can, inflicting others with the hassle of inevitable false positives, false negatives, and false sense of security in a solution that will remain flawed regardless of your own level of patience to throw new versions out.
ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
> All you can do is continually refine it once you deploy it. A bit damned if you do, damned if you don't you could also get it to work with fewer false positives before deploying it, so more like damned if you do rush to market without proper testing and not-damned if you're thoughtful and do minimal testing first (which would obviously include dancing) or, alternatively, just don't deploy and keep deployed a feature which fails so often and for which failures have such a significant impact on people
- johnnyanmac 3y ago
  >you could also get it to work with fewer false positives before deploying it I'm sure they did.
  - ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
    "fewer" obviously means fewer than it has now: the amount it currently has is too many, the amount it needs to have is fewer than the amount it currently has this means they either didn't get it to work with fewer false positives than it has, or they did, then they discarded those improvements, leading to the inadequate release we have now (in which, again, the amount of false positives is too many)