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How on earth can you claim to feel like you havent missed out on much when youve never tried it. What you're describing is more akin to growing up in your pare

How on earth can you claim to feel like you havent missed out on much when youve never tried it. What you're describing is more akin to growing up in your parents religion than making a personal choice.

ThrowMeABC 3y ago
I have never used heroin or other hard drugs. And I do not intent to. So I might have missed out, you say?
- leoedin 3y ago
  Well, yes, you have missed out. Clearly you're choosing to miss out because you don't think it's worth it - but that doesn't change the fact you're missing out.
- episteme 3y ago
  I see what you're saying but this only leads to a discussion about the differences between heroin and alcohol, rather than deciding if you can roughly judge alcohol use from the outside.
- Tildey 3y ago
  You’ll be missing out on some experiences for sure. Would it be a net positive? Probably not. But you really can’t quite comprehend the feelings you’re missing out on. There might be tangential things you don’t experience too, places you’ll never go, and people you’ll never meet. -Someone who has experienced “hard” drugs
- pfannkuchen 3y ago
  Alcohol has been a significant part of many cultures for thousands of years, while heroin most certainly has not (and still is not to this day, aside from a cultural fringe here and there). That seems like a relevant difference?
- monsieurbanana 3y ago
  If most of the population did heroine and hard drugs to socialize then probably, yeah? I've also never drank besides the occasional cocktail, and I can count on my hands the number of times I've bent to a bar. I had other kind of experiences instead and I wouldn't change it, but of course I've missed out on certain things.
  - mantas 3y ago
    „Most of population did“ is not exactly a good meter wether something is good or bad. „Most of population did“ quite a few things that didn't turn out that well.
    - monsieurbanana 3y ago
      We're talking about "missing out", not about something being a net positive or a net negative. But also that was just to point out that IMO the analogy with hard drugs doesn't work, I don't want to debate about a hypothetical world where most people do hard drugs.
      - mantas 3y ago
        „Missing out“ does have a cultural weight of being net positive. Nobody says he just missed out on crashing into a tree on a windy road.
      - Detrytus 3y ago
        That world is not hypothetical: there's a debate whether we should differentiate between "soft" and "hard" drugs (because we might be encouraging people to use the soft ones by doing so), but one thing is for sure: alcohol is a "hard" drug, same as heroin.
- brnt 3y ago
  Quite literally you have missed out, yes. The question is: is that a problem? I generally don't suffer from FOMO, and any current science on alcohol (which the WHO basically classifies as hard drug, it's just one that's culturally accepted in many places) is pointing towards the safe dose being 0. I unfortunately come from a culture where alcohol consumption is accepted, so it's been harder than I would like to break with tradition in the face of science, but doing so it a good thing, and if your cultural background helps you a hand because it does not accept alcohol as readily as mine, more power to you. Drugs FOMO is some of the stupidest FOMO around. I've nothing against using soft drugs, but making any drug part of your life style is almost certainly a bad idea, and if never even trying suits your personality type (some are just more easily addicted than others), then you are wise for steering clear, not an ignorant traditionalist (or at least, not necessarily so). That does not mean gathering in third places is problematic, I do wish we could come up with ways of doing it without the expectation of the consumption of alcohol.
  - cm2187 3y ago
    The only safe speed on a car is also 0.
    - developer93 3y ago
      I don't think that takes away from their point
      - cm2187 3y ago
        It means you accept some risk if you get some utility. You can justify anything with a zero risk policy.
    - vincnetas 3y ago
      But we accept risk because of benefits a car moving faster than 0 brings. I might say same about some of psychedelic drugs. At least from my personal experience.
    - cassonmars 3y ago
- atoav 3y ago
  Do you consider the adicitiveness of alcohol to be the same as that of heroin?
  - icameron 3y ago
    I was surprised to learn that alcohol withdrawal can be fatal, unlike heroin, which is incredibly uncomfortable but not fatal.
- rootsudo 3y ago
  There is a community around drug users, especially the type they select to use. So - while that decision tree never happens to you, to some people, invested in the community and such would say yes. That's the beauty of life. You write your own adventure. Whether people know it or not... eh.
- Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
  You do miss out, but of course the value of what you miss out is nothing compared to the devastating consequences to their life that practically everyone using heroin experience. On the other hand, many people drink alcohol and live perfectly normal lives. So I don't think that's an informative comparison.
- emptyfile 3y ago
  [dead]
FpUser 3y ago
I did social drinking and in the beginning it was cool. At some point however it became really boring and I stopped completely (well ok in 10 years since I'd stopped I might have drank 3 glasses of wine). I still hang out with the same friends and there are no problems at all.
vintermann 3y ago
I dare say we never-drinkers know a lot more about the drinking life we miss out on than you drinkers know about the never-drinking life you miss out on. That's true of most minority positions, just like atheists generally know more about Christians than vice versa ... since you brought up religion, I'd say it is going with the drinking culture flow that is the equivalent of blindly staying with your parent's religion. And just like with atheism vs. religion, we don't just always make the choice that's easy and comfortable. Like the guy above here who finds that he's more included socially when he drinks - yeah, no shit he is, and he'd be more included in a Pentecostal meeting too if he spoke in tongues. Should we all just go along with things that seem dishonest or insane to us, for the sake of fitting in?
- Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
  > I dare say we never-drinkers know a lot more about the drinking life we miss out on than you drinkers know about the never-drinking life you miss out on. I dare say the opposite, as many drinkers routinely experience not drinking, while the opposite is by definition not true. I'm a drinker but I have sometimes spent several months without drinking, for various reasons. Including spending months at countries where I didn't drink at all and people I met wouldn't even know whether I usually drink or not. Honestly I have never saw those wonders of the "never-drinking life" that I'm supposed to be missing. It's the same (drinkers can meet friends during the day and outside of bars, too!) minus the activities that involve drinking.
  - ozim 3y ago
    Upvote for this, because that is funny reading person who never drinks not realizing that normal people spend most of their lives being sober. -- disclaimer I refer to "normal" people who drink but are not addicted. Non drinking people are normal as well.
    - vintermann 3y ago
      Of course I realize that. Just like I realize Christians don't spend every walking moment talking in tongues. Doesn't mean they understand the atheist life better than atheists understand theirs. Aside, this sort of "hilarious reply!" post isn't exactly nice when I'm right here is it.
ramraj07 3y ago
Of course I know I’m missing out on a lot. We all do. You reach peace and wisdom by acknowledging that you’re not gonna experience EVERYTHING. The question is what matters more to you. I decided and am happy that I chose to forego midnight escapades fueled by alcohol or the pursuit of it. In return I’ve gained more time when I’m at peace, more valuable time with friends, and one less vice to worry about.
- hospitalJail 3y ago
  No you are not missing out. Heck, if you really want to try it once for the experience, go ahead under supervision. And don't fall for the 'it didn't ruin my life the first time'. That is just the bait. Its never as good as the first time, you chase the dragon, and you feel like crap later.
Kneecaps07 3y ago
As someone who drank heavily for ten years, I can confirm that this person didn't miss out on anything, except feeling like crap all the time, and money that disappears.
- joenot443 3y ago
  As someone who's only ever drank moderately and has generally enjoyed it, I can confirm that you way overdid it. If you're feeling like crap all the time and waking up with your money gone, perhaps the problem lay within the drinker, not the drink.
- convalescindrey 3y ago
  There are levels between "never touched a glass, don't even enter a bar" and "drinking heavily and feeling like crap all the time". FWIW, I've had my deepest conversations in late evenings after a gig with a glass of white wine in my hand from which I sipped for like an hour. (I'm a musician.) My life would be fundamentally different without a single sip or even entering a bar, and I would really miss something.
- emptyfile 3y ago
  [dead]
- brookst 3y ago
  I’m glad you recovered. But I think you’re mistaken to claim that everyone who enjoys great wine, or whiskey, or beer, is getting nothing from it.
FrustratedMonky 3y ago
I don't have to try heroin to know I'm not missing out. It isn't all religion. Alcohol is a poison, by the definition of poison. There are a hundred studies on its negative effects.
- hbn 3y ago
  There isn't thousands of years of social precedence around winding down by shooting heroine with your friends. No one's saying alcohol is healthy, but you're certainly cutting out a certain potential for social experiences by avoiding bars and alcohol. For some people the effect help them loosen up enough to have positive, meaningful interactions they wouldn't have otherwise.
  - FrustratedMonky 3y ago
    As a past high functioning alcoholic. That line of reasoning sounds very familiar. I used to tell myself the same thing. But once you stop drinking, you start seeing that the drinking was adding to the stress, and personal relationships were not as 'meaningful' as I thought. Hanging out drinking is not as 'deep' as it appears when not drinking. Many studies do show that alcohol leads to additional stress, which then drives the need for additional drinking. EDIT Don't take me wrong. You seemed to really focus on the Religious side. I'm just saying that there are a lot of valid Health Reasons (Non-Moral, Non-religious) reasons not to drink. And, I'm not saying I don't like drinking. Just because I'm an addict doesn't mean I don't like drinking.

ThrowMeABC 3y ago

I have never used heroin or other hard drugs. And I do not intent to. So I might have missed out, you say?

leoedin 3y ago
Well, yes, you have missed out. Clearly you're choosing to miss out because you don't think it's worth it - but that doesn't change the fact you're missing out.
episteme 3y ago
I see what you're saying but this only leads to a discussion about the differences between heroin and alcohol, rather than deciding if you can roughly judge alcohol use from the outside.
Tildey 3y ago
You’ll be missing out on some experiences for sure. Would it be a net positive? Probably not. But you really can’t quite comprehend the feelings you’re missing out on. There might be tangential things you don’t experience too, places you’ll never go, and people you’ll never meet. -Someone who has experienced “hard” drugs
pfannkuchen 3y ago
Alcohol has been a significant part of many cultures for thousands of years, while heroin most certainly has not (and still is not to this day, aside from a cultural fringe here and there). That seems like a relevant difference?
monsieurbanana 3y ago
If most of the population did heroine and hard drugs to socialize then probably, yeah? I've also never drank besides the occasional cocktail, and I can count on my hands the number of times I've bent to a bar. I had other kind of experiences instead and I wouldn't change it, but of course I've missed out on certain things.
- mantas 3y ago
  „Most of population did“ is not exactly a good meter wether something is good or bad. „Most of population did“ quite a few things that didn't turn out that well.
  - monsieurbanana 3y ago
    We're talking about "missing out", not about something being a net positive or a net negative. But also that was just to point out that IMO the analogy with hard drugs doesn't work, I don't want to debate about a hypothetical world where most people do hard drugs.
    - mantas 3y ago
      „Missing out“ does have a cultural weight of being net positive. Nobody says he just missed out on crashing into a tree on a windy road.
    - Detrytus 3y ago
      That world is not hypothetical: there's a debate whether we should differentiate between "soft" and "hard" drugs (because we might be encouraging people to use the soft ones by doing so), but one thing is for sure: alcohol is a "hard" drug, same as heroin.
brnt 3y ago
Quite literally you have missed out, yes. The question is: is that a problem? I generally don't suffer from FOMO, and any current science on alcohol (which the WHO basically classifies as hard drug, it's just one that's culturally accepted in many places) is pointing towards the safe dose being 0. I unfortunately come from a culture where alcohol consumption is accepted, so it's been harder than I would like to break with tradition in the face of science, but doing so it a good thing, and if your cultural background helps you a hand because it does not accept alcohol as readily as mine, more power to you. Drugs FOMO is some of the stupidest FOMO around. I've nothing against using soft drugs, but making any drug part of your life style is almost certainly a bad idea, and if never even trying suits your personality type (some are just more easily addicted than others), then you are wise for steering clear, not an ignorant traditionalist (or at least, not necessarily so). That does not mean gathering in third places is problematic, I do wish we could come up with ways of doing it without the expectation of the consumption of alcohol.
- cm2187 3y ago
  The only safe speed on a car is also 0.
  - developer93 3y ago
    I don't think that takes away from their point
    - cm2187 3y ago
      It means you accept some risk if you get some utility. You can justify anything with a zero risk policy.
  - vincnetas 3y ago
    But we accept risk because of benefits a car moving faster than 0 brings. I might say same about some of psychedelic drugs. At least from my personal experience.
  - cassonmars 3y ago
atoav 3y ago
Do you consider the adicitiveness of alcohol to be the same as that of heroin?
- icameron 3y ago
  I was surprised to learn that alcohol withdrawal can be fatal, unlike heroin, which is incredibly uncomfortable but not fatal.
rootsudo 3y ago
There is a community around drug users, especially the type they select to use. So - while that decision tree never happens to you, to some people, invested in the community and such would say yes. That's the beauty of life. You write your own adventure. Whether people know it or not... eh.
Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
You do miss out, but of course the value of what you miss out is nothing compared to the devastating consequences to their life that practically everyone using heroin experience. On the other hand, many people drink alcohol and live perfectly normal lives. So I don't think that's an informative comparison.
emptyfile 3y ago
[dead]

FpUser 3y ago

I did social drinking and in the beginning it was cool. At some point however it became really boring and I stopped completely (well ok in 10 years since I'd stopped I might have drank 3 glasses of wine). I still hang out with the same friends and there are no problems at all.

vintermann 3y ago

I dare say we never-drinkers know a lot more about the drinking life we miss out on than you drinkers know about the never-drinking life you miss out on. That's true of most minority positions, just like atheists generally know more about Christians than vice versa ... since you brought up religion, I'd say it is going with the drinking culture flow that is the equivalent of blindly staying with your parent's religion. And just like with atheism vs. religion, we don't just always make the choice that's easy and comfortable. Like the guy above here who finds that he's more included socially when he drinks - yeah, no shit he is, and he'd be more included in a Pentecostal meeting too if he spoke in tongues. Should we all just go along with things that seem dishonest or insane to us, for the sake of fitting in?

Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
> I dare say we never-drinkers know a lot more about the drinking life we miss out on than you drinkers know about the never-drinking life you miss out on. I dare say the opposite, as many drinkers routinely experience not drinking, while the opposite is by definition not true. I'm a drinker but I have sometimes spent several months without drinking, for various reasons. Including spending months at countries where I didn't drink at all and people I met wouldn't even know whether I usually drink or not. Honestly I have never saw those wonders of the "never-drinking life" that I'm supposed to be missing. It's the same (drinkers can meet friends during the day and outside of bars, too!) minus the activities that involve drinking.
- ozim 3y ago
  Upvote for this, because that is funny reading person who never drinks not realizing that normal people spend most of their lives being sober. -- disclaimer I refer to "normal" people who drink but are not addicted. Non drinking people are normal as well.
  - vintermann 3y ago
    Of course I realize that. Just like I realize Christians don't spend every walking moment talking in tongues. Doesn't mean they understand the atheist life better than atheists understand theirs. Aside, this sort of "hilarious reply!" post isn't exactly nice when I'm right here is it.

ramraj07 3y ago

Of course I know I’m missing out on a lot. We all do. You reach peace and wisdom by acknowledging that you’re not gonna experience EVERYTHING. The question is what matters more to you. I decided and am happy that I chose to forego midnight escapades fueled by alcohol or the pursuit of it. In return I’ve gained more time when I’m at peace, more valuable time with friends, and one less vice to worry about.

hospitalJail 3y ago
No you are not missing out. Heck, if you really want to try it once for the experience, go ahead under supervision. And don't fall for the 'it didn't ruin my life the first time'. That is just the bait. Its never as good as the first time, you chase the dragon, and you feel like crap later.

Kneecaps07 3y ago

As someone who drank heavily for ten years, I can confirm that this person didn't miss out on anything, except feeling like crap all the time, and money that disappears.

joenot443 3y ago
As someone who's only ever drank moderately and has generally enjoyed it, I can confirm that you way overdid it. If you're feeling like crap all the time and waking up with your money gone, perhaps the problem lay within the drinker, not the drink.
convalescindrey 3y ago
There are levels between "never touched a glass, don't even enter a bar" and "drinking heavily and feeling like crap all the time". FWIW, I've had my deepest conversations in late evenings after a gig with a glass of white wine in my hand from which I sipped for like an hour. (I'm a musician.) My life would be fundamentally different without a single sip or even entering a bar, and I would really miss something.
emptyfile 3y ago
[dead]
brookst 3y ago
I’m glad you recovered. But I think you’re mistaken to claim that everyone who enjoys great wine, or whiskey, or beer, is getting nothing from it.

FrustratedMonky 3y ago

I don't have to try heroin to know I'm not missing out. It isn't all religion. Alcohol is a poison, by the definition of poison. There are a hundred studies on its negative effects.

hbn 3y ago
There isn't thousands of years of social precedence around winding down by shooting heroine with your friends. No one's saying alcohol is healthy, but you're certainly cutting out a certain potential for social experiences by avoiding bars and alcohol. For some people the effect help them loosen up enough to have positive, meaningful interactions they wouldn't have otherwise.
- FrustratedMonky 3y ago
  As a past high functioning alcoholic. That line of reasoning sounds very familiar. I used to tell myself the same thing. But once you stop drinking, you start seeing that the drinking was adding to the stress, and personal relationships were not as 'meaningful' as I thought. Hanging out drinking is not as 'deep' as it appears when not drinking. Many studies do show that alcohol leads to additional stress, which then drives the need for additional drinking. EDIT Don't take me wrong. You seemed to really focus on the Religious side. I'm just saying that there are a lot of valid Health Reasons (Non-Moral, Non-religious) reasons not to drink. And, I'm not saying I don't like drinking. Just because I'm an addict doesn't mean I don't like drinking.