5 ms·

Developers want something that is like Heroku

danjac 3y ago
Pretty much, yes. An application developer should be able to focus on data model, business logic and user interface, and everything else at a minimum. If you are burning your available hours working on issues with your infrastructure - whether it's cloud or hosted or on-prem - that's not delivering business value.
- gravlaks 3y ago
  As long as it's part of the required steps to delivering business value, it doesn't matter that much if it's application code or infrastructure (as code). Both are required, hence both are delivering business value.
  - danjac 3y ago
    OK, but ultimately the customer wants a product built, features added and bugs fixed within whatever timescale and budget. With all things being equal, they would prefer that you spend the time on those things, and not on infra. Now of course, you will have to spend some time on infra, but that should be minimised as much as possible. Whether that is using a home-grown Kubernetes based platform or a PAAS or cloud solution depends on your requirements, skill-set, budget and time, but your aim should be to have the simplest solution that works.
mdekkers 3y ago
Developers don’t want to ops.
- sam_lowry_ 3y ago
  You'll surprised.
  - mdekkers 3y ago
    I don’t doubt there are developers that don’t mind or enjoy doing ops, but the very vast majority of developers I have worked with don’t want to do ops. Perhaps it’s ancedata, and perhaps it’s a selection bias as I tend to be hired to solve these and related problems. It doesn’t appear that I’m the only one that sees this though: https://www.infoworld.com/article/3669477/devs-don-t-want-to-do-ops.html https://www.infoworld.com/article/3669477/devs-don-t-want-to...
    - candiodari 3y ago
      Just give those developers access to a large company IT and IT security department and they'll be SCREAMING to do their own ops in no time at all. I mean, if they don't just outright quit directly.
    - user6723 3y ago
      Most developers barely know how to use their computer, let alone a computer to be used to run something in production. t. DevOps/cloud guy
systemvoltage 3y ago
I want a total chad Heroku at good prices, not this weak ass 0.04vCPU crap for $120/month. Give me 8vCPU 16GB ram machine at Hetzner prices that has Heroku-like devops layer. The marginal cost of Heroku software layer should IMO get ammortized into nothingness.
- user6723 3y ago
  I may have something for you in the works actually. A team I consult with is working on a bare-metal as a service based service offering that provides a Heroku-like experience. Storage is network-attached on a low latency network and customers can select dedicated disk pools if they want. One of the interfaces to the infra is a Heroku-like interface.
  - systemvoltage 3y ago
    They will win. Heroku is too expensive for what it offers for SMBs (not VC backed).

Pretty much, yes. An application developer should be able to focus on data model, business logic and user interface, and everything else at a minimum. If you are burning your available hours working on issues with your infrastructure - whether it's cloud or hosted or on-prem - that's not delivering business value.

gravlaks 3y ago
As long as it's part of the required steps to delivering business value, it doesn't matter that much if it's application code or infrastructure (as code). Both are required, hence both are delivering business value.
- danjac 3y ago
  OK, but ultimately the customer wants a product built, features added and bugs fixed within whatever timescale and budget. With all things being equal, they would prefer that you spend the time on those things, and not on infra. Now of course, you will have to spend some time on infra, but that should be minimised as much as possible. Whether that is using a home-grown Kubernetes based platform or a PAAS or cloud solution depends on your requirements, skill-set, budget and time, but your aim should be to have the simplest solution that works.

mdekkers 3y ago

Developers don’t want to ops.

sam_lowry_ 3y ago
You'll surprised.
- mdekkers 3y ago
  I don’t doubt there are developers that don’t mind or enjoy doing ops, but the very vast majority of developers I have worked with don’t want to do ops. Perhaps it’s ancedata, and perhaps it’s a selection bias as I tend to be hired to solve these and related problems. It doesn’t appear that I’m the only one that sees this though: https://www.infoworld.com/article/3669477/devs-don-t-want-to-do-ops.html https://www.infoworld.com/article/3669477/devs-don-t-want-to...
  - candiodari 3y ago
    Just give those developers access to a large company IT and IT security department and they'll be SCREAMING to do their own ops in no time at all. I mean, if they don't just outright quit directly.
  - user6723 3y ago
    Most developers barely know how to use their computer, let alone a computer to be used to run something in production. t. DevOps/cloud guy

systemvoltage 3y ago

I want a total chad Heroku at good prices, not this weak ass 0.04vCPU crap for $120/month. Give me 8vCPU 16GB ram machine at Hetzner prices that has Heroku-like devops layer. The marginal cost of Heroku software layer should IMO get ammortized into nothingness.

user6723 3y ago
I may have something for you in the works actually. A team I consult with is working on a bare-metal as a service based service offering that provides a Heroku-like experience. Storage is network-attached on a low latency network and customers can select dedicated disk pools if they want. One of the interfaces to the infra is a Heroku-like interface.
- systemvoltage 3y ago
  They will win. Heroku is too expensive for what it offers for SMBs (not VC backed).