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Argos pioneered a new form of catalogue retail where customers made their order in one of the company’s high-street shops before waiting for their items to be b

Argos pioneered a new form of catalogue retail where customers made their order in one of the company’s high-street shops before waiting for their items to be brought out from the warehouse at the rear. Sounds a lot like the British version of the U. S.'s Service Merchandise[0]. Write down your order on a little sheet of paper, hand it to store personnel, wait for your items to come rolling down the roller ramp. On an unrelated note, but from TFA: In 1979, 42% of British citizens lived in council housing Wait a minute, wut? Explain to this former colonist what cultural cue he's missing, because how is it possible that 42% of a country's population lives in public housing? Or is it not "public housing", as in U. S.-style subsidized housing? Or were times just that bad in Great Britain in the 70s? EDIT: thanks for the context, responders. Apologies if I worded it poorly. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_Merchandise https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_Merchandise

philjohn 3y ago
Not sure it's classed as "times that bad" (although the 70's weren't great), but more a political decision that people of less means could have affordable housing. Then Thatcher allowed people to buy their council houses, and we are where we now are.
jrmg 3y ago
Asking if things were 'just that bad' is a bit of a value judgement. Yes, they were 'just that bad', but from WWII to 70s the view that the government _should_ be involved in things like housing was a lot more prevalent in the UK than it is now. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_house https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_house
hereonout2 3y ago
That was in 1979, the 42%, it's nothing like that now. But yes they are / were greatly subsidised housing. This was after a period of massive home building and the introduction of the welfare state after WW2. I don't think Britain was a shining economic example back then (it was known as the sick man of Europe), but council houses seemed rather a good thing. My mother's parents were given one in the late 50's, where they raised four children and my grandparents resided until there deaths 50+ years later. Although council housing still exists it's much rarer now, and your chances of recreating what my grandparents had are slim to none.
- 2b3a51 3y ago
  Not sure there is a lot of subsidy for council/housing association housing. Building costs paid back over 60 years or so generally. Perhaps land may be allocated?
cjs_ac 3y ago
> Wait a minute, wut? Explain to this former colonist what cultural cue he's missing, because how is it possible that 42% of a country's population lives in public housing? Or is it not "public housing", as in U. S.-style subsidized housing? Or were times just that bad in Great Britain in the 70s? There were a few factors. 1. Yes, many people were very poor. Today, many Britons are still very poor. 2. In the war, an awful lot of housing was destroyed. Entire towns (Harlow and Milton Keynes are prominent examples) were built from open countryside to house the displaced. The overwhelming majority of this housing remained in government ownership until Thatcher's 'Right to Buy' reforms, which are the origin of the present housing crisis in the UK. 3. Prior to the war, the United Kingdom was the most densely populated country on Earth; during the war, people 'mucked in' to help each other during the nationwide trauma of Total War[0], and after the war, returning servicemen and servicewomen demanded that the sacrifices made amount to something. The governments formed by the Labour Party from 1945 to 1980 instituted a great many social reforms - the National Health Service, expansion of state schooling, social care, and so on - that made good on these demands, and were seen as improvements to the nation, rather than government overreach. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war
- _dain_ 3y ago
  They also introduced the Town and Country Planning Act of 1947, which made it illegal to build any kind of housing or modify existing housing without asking permission from the government. We would not need council housing nowadays if the private sector were simply allowed to fill the market demand. We are no longer in the days when children played in the rubble of cities flattened by the Luftwaffe. Blaming Thatcher is too kind to the current government. They're the ones who keep listening to nimbys. Thatcher's mistake is that she didn't go far enough; axing the 1947 Act and its descendants should have been part of the supply-side reforms. The fondness for council housing is an example of a peculiar psychological coping mechanism of Britons, stemming from imperial decline. We pretend a necessary evil was something positively desirable all along. The Americans are right, it is actually embarrassing to have 42% of your population in state-owned housing, I'm sorry to say.
  - 3y ago
_dain_ 3y ago
>Explain to this former colonist what cultural cue he's missing, because how is it possible that 42% of a country's population lives in public housing? Because they criminalized private construction of housing. It can only be done after a lengthy procedure where you beg for permission from a bureaucrat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_and_Country_Planning_Act_1947 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_and_Country_Planning_Act_... >The Act established that planning permission was required for land development; ownership alone no longer conferred the right to develop the land.[1]
qingcharles 3y ago
The UK between 1945 and 1985 was practically a communist country. The government owned significant portions of industry, housing, healthcare, transport, manufacturing etc. Vital industries including coal, steel, water, electricity, gas, railways, and airlines were nationalized under the Labour government's program following the Second World War. The National Health Service (NHS) was established in 1948, offering government-funded healthcare to all residents. IIRC correctly in the early 80s the highest tax band was 95%. I asked GPT4 to convince me that the UK was actually a communist nation during that time, but it won't bite: "While the UK did assert considerable control over various industries from 1950 to 1980 (paralleling elements of communist societies), its democratic governance, surviving private industry, and support of property rights exhibit significant deviations from true communism. The era could more accurately be described as an age of robust social democracy." (emphasis mine)

philjohn 3y ago

Not sure it's classed as "times that bad" (although the 70's weren't great), but more a political decision that people of less means could have affordable housing. Then Thatcher allowed people to buy their council houses, and we are where we now are.

jrmg 3y ago

Asking if things were 'just that bad' is a bit of a value judgement. Yes, they were 'just that bad', but from WWII to 70s the view that the government _should_ be involved in things like housing was a lot more prevalent in the UK than it is now. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_house https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_house

hereonout2 3y ago

That was in 1979, the 42%, it's nothing like that now. But yes they are / were greatly subsidised housing. This was after a period of massive home building and the introduction of the welfare state after WW2. I don't think Britain was a shining economic example back then (it was known as the sick man of Europe), but council houses seemed rather a good thing. My mother's parents were given one in the late 50's, where they raised four children and my grandparents resided until there deaths 50+ years later. Although council housing still exists it's much rarer now, and your chances of recreating what my grandparents had are slim to none.

2b3a51 3y ago
Not sure there is a lot of subsidy for council/housing association housing. Building costs paid back over 60 years or so generally. Perhaps land may be allocated?

cjs_ac 3y ago

> Wait a minute, wut? Explain to this former colonist what cultural cue he's missing, because how is it possible that 42% of a country's population lives in public housing? Or is it not "public housing", as in U. S.-style subsidized housing? Or were times just that bad in Great Britain in the 70s? There were a few factors. 1. Yes, many people were very poor. Today, many Britons are still very poor. 2. In the war, an awful lot of housing was destroyed. Entire towns (Harlow and Milton Keynes are prominent examples) were built from open countryside to house the displaced. The overwhelming majority of this housing remained in government ownership until Thatcher's 'Right to Buy' reforms, which are the origin of the present housing crisis in the UK. 3. Prior to the war, the United Kingdom was the most densely populated country on Earth; during the war, people 'mucked in' to help each other during the nationwide trauma of Total War[0], and after the war, returning servicemen and servicewomen demanded that the sacrifices made amount to something. The governments formed by the Labour Party from 1945 to 1980 instituted a great many social reforms - the National Health Service, expansion of state schooling, social care, and so on - that made good on these demands, and were seen as improvements to the nation, rather than government overreach. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war

_dain_ 3y ago
They also introduced the Town and Country Planning Act of 1947, which made it illegal to build any kind of housing or modify existing housing without asking permission from the government. We would not need council housing nowadays if the private sector were simply allowed to fill the market demand. We are no longer in the days when children played in the rubble of cities flattened by the Luftwaffe. Blaming Thatcher is too kind to the current government. They're the ones who keep listening to nimbys. Thatcher's mistake is that she didn't go far enough; axing the 1947 Act and its descendants should have been part of the supply-side reforms. The fondness for council housing is an example of a peculiar psychological coping mechanism of Britons, stemming from imperial decline. We pretend a necessary evil was something positively desirable all along. The Americans are right, it is actually embarrassing to have 42% of your population in state-owned housing, I'm sorry to say.
- 3y ago

_dain_ 3y ago

>Explain to this former colonist what cultural cue he's missing, because how is it possible that 42% of a country's population lives in public housing? Because they criminalized private construction of housing. It can only be done after a lengthy procedure where you beg for permission from a bureaucrat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_and_Country_Planning_Act_1947 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_and_Country_Planning_Act_... >The Act established that planning permission was required for land development; ownership alone no longer conferred the right to develop the land.[1]

qingcharles 3y ago

The UK between 1945 and 1985 was practically a communist country. The government owned significant portions of industry, housing, healthcare, transport, manufacturing etc. Vital industries including coal, steel, water, electricity, gas, railways, and airlines were nationalized under the Labour government's program following the Second World War. The National Health Service (NHS) was established in 1948, offering government-funded healthcare to all residents. IIRC correctly in the early 80s the highest tax band was 95%. I asked GPT4 to convince me that the UK was actually a communist nation during that time, but it won't bite: "While the UK did assert considerable control over various industries from 1950 to 1980 (paralleling elements of communist societies), its democratic governance, surviving private industry, and support of property rights exhibit significant deviations from true communism. The era could more accurately be described as an age of robust social democracy." (emphasis mine)