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“ They were IIRC also caught red-handed a couple times deliberately releasing updates to older iDevices that would just wreck their battery life and have a few

“ They were IIRC also caught red-handed a couple times deliberately releasing updates to older iDevices that would just wreck their battery life and have a few lawsuits pending about that.” Are you going to just drop an inflammatory statement like that and not even try to provide any information to back it up?

jacquesm 3y ago
Is google down or something? https://www.npr.org/2020/11/18/936268845/apple-agrees-to-pay-113-million-to-settle-batterygate-case-over-iphone-slowdowns https://www.npr.org/2020/11/18/936268845/apple-agrees-to-pay...
- Tagbert 3y ago
  “caught red-handed” implies an intent that is not supported by the evidence. The design of the battery in the 6 turned out to be problematic once the battery reached a certain age. After lots of reports of iPhones shutting down suddenly, Apple issued a software update that slowed down those phones so that they didn’t shut down. They then redesigned the battery and this was not a problem in later models. You talk about a general slow down of phones when the OS is updated. That is most likely due to increased processing needed in later OSs. The early phone CPUs had barely enough processing to do what they needed to do so the added demands of a new OS would drag them down a little. Over time the cumulative effect would add up. This is not unique to iPhones. I have heard the same complaints from Android users. Fortunately modern phone CPUs are powerful enough that they have the cycles to spare and slowdowns are rare.
- Kirby64 3y ago
  That has nothing to do with "wrecking battery life" though. They added a fix to prevent the device from turning off early due to battery brownouts at lower states of charge. It did result in reduced performance (and they got a lawsuit cause they weren't open about why/how they did it) but this wasn't causing excessive battery drain.
  - jq-r 3y ago
    Lets not use this case as a scapegoat and pretend that slowdowns don't exist in iOS. Pretty much from the first iPhone model it's well known that newer iOS releases will slow down your phone and/or make your battery drain faster. I even remember when they actually broke wifi on a lot of phones with an update and pretended that the hardware was defective all the time (which it wasn't). Hell I'm looking right now my old iPhone 8 which got a new genuine battery, and it's a lagging, hot mess so I only use it when I don't want to burn the battery of my new phone. My good colleague resisted updating her iPhone 11 to any newer version of iOS from the one she got, but couple of months ago she couldn't install her banking app anymore so she broke down and updated the OS. Instant laggines, and battery lost close to 40%. Just like that. She got mad, and when the madness subsided, she bought a new iPhone. Mission accomplished for Apple. All of this could be much avoided if they would allow you to install previous versions of iOS, but they don't for obvious reasons. And before anyone mentions security, that is a load of BS because even previous iOS versions get patched up. So planned or premature obsolesence, the user just gets frustrated with an old phone which hardware-wise might be perfectly fine, but software-wise an unusable mess and buys a new phone. I hope the forced user battery replacement works, and I'm sure they could look into these forced software updates which are also largerly contributing to larger problem at hand.
    - Kirby64 3y ago
      The specific accusation was about 'wrecking battery life' and the source was the 'batterygate' lawsuits. This has nothing to do with a scapegoat. Honestly, "it's well known" is anecdotal at best. If you're actually saying it was a problem that battery life dropped 40% from going from one update to another, then media would pick up on this. That's not a small amount here, you're saying battery is now 2/3 the previous runtime. If that was actually reliable and measurable, show me an article that has done testing on before-and-after from one update to another.
      - jq-r 3y ago
        The Batterygate was just a partial response at iOS significantly slowing down even one generation old iPhones, and I don't want to go into that because that's not what I want to discuss. In your second paragraph you completely dismiss my experience I guess because it wasn't published by some online zine which is ridiculous by itself. Online forums like reddit are full of these, my experience says the same, and pretty much the big majority of my friends have iPhones in this neck of woods and there is no question on whats going on. Why there are no articles about it? Dunno, maybe because by now its an old story as this is going on for decades now so it's an accepted fact. Maybe because in US people buy iPhones more often then in Europe so the effect isn't that noticeable? I don't know, and it's not in my interest to care. So I'll put my claim into negative and ask you this: are you claiming that iPhones are not slowed down by newer updates? Are you claiming that perfectly good iPhones even as new as 1.5 years and older are as performant as the lastest gen iPhones with the same iOS (even with brand new batteries)? If so, thats an extraordinary claim and the burden of proof rests on your shoulders. Are you also claiming that you're casually able to install previous versions of iOS so you could get performance back? If car industry did the same after software updates whole industries would collapse. Does your PC even do this nowadays? If you install an OS which actually slows down your computer, you can still re-install a previous version to get your performance back. Not so on the iPhone, you're locked out of that option and we'll screw you, buy a new one.

jacquesm 3y ago

Is google down or something? https://www.npr.org/2020/11/18/936268845/apple-agrees-to-pay-113-million-to-settle-batterygate-case-over-iphone-slowdowns https://www.npr.org/2020/11/18/936268845/apple-agrees-to-pay...

Tagbert 3y ago
“caught red-handed” implies an intent that is not supported by the evidence. The design of the battery in the 6 turned out to be problematic once the battery reached a certain age. After lots of reports of iPhones shutting down suddenly, Apple issued a software update that slowed down those phones so that they didn’t shut down. They then redesigned the battery and this was not a problem in later models. You talk about a general slow down of phones when the OS is updated. That is most likely due to increased processing needed in later OSs. The early phone CPUs had barely enough processing to do what they needed to do so the added demands of a new OS would drag them down a little. Over time the cumulative effect would add up. This is not unique to iPhones. I have heard the same complaints from Android users. Fortunately modern phone CPUs are powerful enough that they have the cycles to spare and slowdowns are rare.
Kirby64 3y ago
That has nothing to do with "wrecking battery life" though. They added a fix to prevent the device from turning off early due to battery brownouts at lower states of charge. It did result in reduced performance (and they got a lawsuit cause they weren't open about why/how they did it) but this wasn't causing excessive battery drain.
- jq-r 3y ago
  Lets not use this case as a scapegoat and pretend that slowdowns don't exist in iOS. Pretty much from the first iPhone model it's well known that newer iOS releases will slow down your phone and/or make your battery drain faster. I even remember when they actually broke wifi on a lot of phones with an update and pretended that the hardware was defective all the time (which it wasn't). Hell I'm looking right now my old iPhone 8 which got a new genuine battery, and it's a lagging, hot mess so I only use it when I don't want to burn the battery of my new phone. My good colleague resisted updating her iPhone 11 to any newer version of iOS from the one she got, but couple of months ago she couldn't install her banking app anymore so she broke down and updated the OS. Instant laggines, and battery lost close to 40%. Just like that. She got mad, and when the madness subsided, she bought a new iPhone. Mission accomplished for Apple. All of this could be much avoided if they would allow you to install previous versions of iOS, but they don't for obvious reasons. And before anyone mentions security, that is a load of BS because even previous iOS versions get patched up. So planned or premature obsolesence, the user just gets frustrated with an old phone which hardware-wise might be perfectly fine, but software-wise an unusable mess and buys a new phone. I hope the forced user battery replacement works, and I'm sure they could look into these forced software updates which are also largerly contributing to larger problem at hand.
  - Kirby64 3y ago
    The specific accusation was about 'wrecking battery life' and the source was the 'batterygate' lawsuits. This has nothing to do with a scapegoat. Honestly, "it's well known" is anecdotal at best. If you're actually saying it was a problem that battery life dropped 40% from going from one update to another, then media would pick up on this. That's not a small amount here, you're saying battery is now 2/3 the previous runtime. If that was actually reliable and measurable, show me an article that has done testing on before-and-after from one update to another.
    - jq-r 3y ago
      The Batterygate was just a partial response at iOS significantly slowing down even one generation old iPhones, and I don't want to go into that because that's not what I want to discuss. In your second paragraph you completely dismiss my experience I guess because it wasn't published by some online zine which is ridiculous by itself. Online forums like reddit are full of these, my experience says the same, and pretty much the big majority of my friends have iPhones in this neck of woods and there is no question on whats going on. Why there are no articles about it? Dunno, maybe because by now its an old story as this is going on for decades now so it's an accepted fact. Maybe because in US people buy iPhones more often then in Europe so the effect isn't that noticeable? I don't know, and it's not in my interest to care. So I'll put my claim into negative and ask you this: are you claiming that iPhones are not slowed down by newer updates? Are you claiming that perfectly good iPhones even as new as 1.5 years and older are as performant as the lastest gen iPhones with the same iOS (even with brand new batteries)? If so, thats an extraordinary claim and the burden of proof rests on your shoulders. Are you also claiming that you're casually able to install previous versions of iOS so you could get performance back? If car industry did the same after software updates whole industries would collapse. Does your PC even do this nowadays? If you install an OS which actually slows down your computer, you can still re-install a previous version to get your performance back. Not so on the iPhone, you're locked out of that option and we'll screw you, buy a new one.