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Yes, because people can't be bothered to change their diets. But it's different now, when there is 8 billions of us. Everything changes. And we can obtain Omeg

by myshpa 3y ago

Yes, because people can't be bothered to change their diets. But it's different now, when there is 8 billions of us. Everything changes. And we can obtain Omega-3 from algae, which is the same source that fish rely on. --- The oceans are home for up to 80% of all life on Earth. Today only 3% of Pacific bluefin tuna remain. Overfishing puts $42 billion tuna industry at risk of collapse. For the first time, sharks are going extinct because of us. Species like thresher, bull, and hammerhead sharks have lost up to 80-99% of their populations in the last two decades. Seabird populations have declined by 70% since the 1950s. Sharks kill 10 people per year. Comparatively, people kill 11,000-30,000 sharks are killed per hour. Approx. 50 million sharks are killed every year as bycatch. Studies estimate that up to 40% of all marine life caught is thrown overboard as bycatch. An Iceland fishery in one month killed approx. 269 harbor porpoises, 900 seals of four different species, and 5000 seabirds. The Iceland fishery was awarded the blue tick by the MSC. There are 4,600,000 commercial fishing vessels in the world. 10,000+ dolphins are killed as bycatch off the coast of France every year. Over 300,000 whales, dolphins, and porpoises are killed as bycatch every year. 46% of the Pacific garbage patch is fishing nets. There is enough long line set every day to wrap around the planet 500x. Six out of seven species of sea turtles are either threatened or endangered due to fishing. The fishing industry kills more animals in a day than the Deepwater Horizon oil spill did in months. Fishing has become a major threat to coral reefs from the Middle East to the Caribbean, where 90% of large fish have disappeared. In the 1830s, a typical fishing boat caught 1-2 tons of halibut per day, but today the entire fishing fleet catches 1-2 tons across the entire year. 2.7 trillion fish are caught every year, or up to 5 million caught every minute. Fish populations are in decline to near extinction. Virtually empty oceans by 2048. - https://www.seaspiracy.org/facts https://www.seaspiracy.org/facts

belorn 3y ago
Are you saying that American Heart Association, NHS UK, British Dietetic Association and WHO recommendations are wrong because people can't be bothered to change their diets. One can not have their cake and eat it too. Either we defer truth to the experts and cite what they say as if that was the end of discussion, or we use the word of experts to advance the discussions with the caveat that experts recommendation exist in the context of culture and concessions that those expert individuals made. This apply to both a vegan diet and fish. Current industry farming technique is terrible and belong to a time when we did not care about animal welfare nor did we understand the destructive an inhumane nature of large scale industry. Sadly this apply to every form of farming, from animals, to agriculture, to fishing. As a society we don't know how to generate a lot of food at the lowest price possible without the side effect of massive harms. And for many people eating plants only is extremely difficult. Metabolic illnesses have significant increased in the last 100 years (or those who suffer from them have managed to survive and reproduce). A likely contributing cause is our current lifestyle of using artificial light (harming the circadian clock) and Sedentary lifestyle. All this contribute to a smaller selection of diets that any individual can eat and stay healthy on, and it mostly up to trial and error to determine which diet work with any particular individual. Beans and grains works for some people and in others it will cause drowsiness, allergic reaction, and/or pain. As an random example, look up FODMAPs and check around how different people react to those foods. Take a random vegetarian diet and how many items list high or low, and then compare it to a random non-vegetarian diet. Diet and health are complex issues with few simple answers, and most dietitians seem to operate on a extremely individualistic level.
- myshpa 3y ago
  > Are you saying that American Heart Association, NHS UK, British Dietetic Association and WHO recommendations are wrong because people can't be bothered to change their diets. Those recommendations are not inherently incorrect. If obtaining Omega-3 from algae were not an available option, it would be a viable choice. If fish populations were not severely depleted, it would be a suitable choice. If there were considerably fewer humans, it would be a reasonable option. However, it appears that environmental impacts were not adequately considered in their viewpoints. I have selected a citation affirming that plant-only diets are a viable way forward. > experts recommendation exist in the context of culture Culture is just stories we tell ourselves. Those stories may not be true or moral or right. It's better explained in this short video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7JE8j5Ncmw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7JE8j5Ncmw > As a society we don't know how to generate a lot of food at the lowest price possible without the side effect of massive harms. But we do know how to generate a lot of food without excessive harms. The only problem is ... price. But there we're getting to the problems of our current system. That would be even harder and longer discussion. > Metabolic illnesses have significant increased in the last 100 years ... likely contributing cause is our current lifestyle of using artificial light and Sedentary lifestyle Other possible culprits for the increase in metabolic diseases in past decades include factors such as changes in dietary patterns, increased consumption of processed foods high in sugar and unhealthy fats and lack of physical activity. We're eating much more meat/dairy that we've been eating in centuries before, and we're using too much poisons in our food production. > for many people eating plants only is extremely difficult Many individuals have depleted gut microbiomes due to Western dietary patterns (e.g., processed foods, sugar, lack of fiber), but this can be resolved through dietary changes. The number of individuals who require a diet solely comprised of animal-derived foods would be extremely small. Veganism's definition also includes a practicality clause. "Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals."

by myshpa 3y ago

belorn 3y ago

Are you saying that American Heart Association, NHS UK, British Dietetic Association and WHO recommendations are wrong because people can't be bothered to change their diets. One can not have their cake and eat it too. Either we defer truth to the experts and cite what they say as if that was the end of discussion, or we use the word of experts to advance the discussions with the caveat that experts recommendation exist in the context of culture and concessions that those expert individuals made. This apply to both a vegan diet and fish. Current industry farming technique is terrible and belong to a time when we did not care about animal welfare nor did we understand the destructive an inhumane nature of large scale industry. Sadly this apply to every form of farming, from animals, to agriculture, to fishing. As a society we don't know how to generate a lot of food at the lowest price possible without the side effect of massive harms. And for many people eating plants only is extremely difficult. Metabolic illnesses have significant increased in the last 100 years (or those who suffer from them have managed to survive and reproduce). A likely contributing cause is our current lifestyle of using artificial light (harming the circadian clock) and Sedentary lifestyle. All this contribute to a smaller selection of diets that any individual can eat and stay healthy on, and it mostly up to trial and error to determine which diet work with any particular individual. Beans and grains works for some people and in others it will cause drowsiness, allergic reaction, and/or pain. As an random example, look up FODMAPs and check around how different people react to those foods. Take a random vegetarian diet and how many items list high or low, and then compare it to a random non-vegetarian diet. Diet and health are complex issues with few simple answers, and most dietitians seem to operate on a extremely individualistic level.

myshpa 3y ago
> Are you saying that American Heart Association, NHS UK, British Dietetic Association and WHO recommendations are wrong because people can't be bothered to change their diets. Those recommendations are not inherently incorrect. If obtaining Omega-3 from algae were not an available option, it would be a viable choice. If fish populations were not severely depleted, it would be a suitable choice. If there were considerably fewer humans, it would be a reasonable option. However, it appears that environmental impacts were not adequately considered in their viewpoints. I have selected a citation affirming that plant-only diets are a viable way forward. > experts recommendation exist in the context of culture Culture is just stories we tell ourselves. Those stories may not be true or moral or right. It's better explained in this short video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7JE8j5Ncmw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7JE8j5Ncmw > As a society we don't know how to generate a lot of food at the lowest price possible without the side effect of massive harms. But we do know how to generate a lot of food without excessive harms. The only problem is ... price. But there we're getting to the problems of our current system. That would be even harder and longer discussion. > Metabolic illnesses have significant increased in the last 100 years ... likely contributing cause is our current lifestyle of using artificial light and Sedentary lifestyle Other possible culprits for the increase in metabolic diseases in past decades include factors such as changes in dietary patterns, increased consumption of processed foods high in sugar and unhealthy fats and lack of physical activity. We're eating much more meat/dairy that we've been eating in centuries before, and we're using too much poisons in our food production. > for many people eating plants only is extremely difficult Many individuals have depleted gut microbiomes due to Western dietary patterns (e.g., processed foods, sugar, lack of fiber), but this can be resolved through dietary changes. The number of individuals who require a diet solely comprised of animal-derived foods would be extremely small. Veganism's definition also includes a practicality clause. "Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals."