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This is like saying developers don't care about the software they work on and intentionally introduce tech debt for the sake of job security. True in some cases

by mjr00 3y ago

This is like saying developers don't care about the software they work on and intentionally introduce tech debt for the sake of job security. True in some cases, not universally applicable.

spacemadness 3y ago
I hate to break it to you but people do exactly this in the form of grossly over-engineered solutions with fancy design docs that impress the right people at the right time.
- mjr00 3y ago
  That's why I said "true in some cases" Though in my 15+ year career as dev and dev manager I've only ever encountered one person who was intentionally building things poorly for job-related reasons. (Even then, that was for a company doing a federal government contract, so arguably building it in a way that encouraged expensive maintenance contracts was good for the business, in a perverse way.) I've seen a lot of overengineered solutions with fancy design docs but they've always come from a good place, genuinely thinking that the hot new tool X or architecture Y is going to solve all of the problems. I've built some poorly overengineered solutions myself. But even if that road of overengineered solutions leads to hell, it's at least paved with good intentions.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    > Though in my 15+ year career as dev and dev manager I've only ever encountered one person who was intentionally building things poorly for job-related reasons. I agree, I've very rarely seen this done by individuals. However, I've often seen it done by teams.
  - drewcoo 3y ago
    > thinking that the hot new tool X or architecture Y is going to solve all of the problems Wanting to use X and Y and finding a way to shoehorn them into usefulness is called "motivated reasoning." Does that look any different from "coming from a good place?" Heck, it could be both motivated reasoning and coming from a good place.
onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
I guess we've had wildly different career paths. The VAST majority of developers I've worked with couldn't give 2 shits about the business (as they probably shouldn't - the biz doesn't give 2 shits about them). Most of them don't really care about self preservation, because if you're an IC - it's so much easier to get a job compared to a manager or a VP or an exec. But most of them just want to build new things and use the hottest framework or drive some overly complex design just for the sake of it. At the same time, there's bugs that actually effect customers that no one is working on, because no one has time for that because they're too busy re-writing something in some new language or framework or whatever...

by mjr00 3y ago

This is like saying developers don't care about the software they work on and intentionally introduce tech debt for the sake of job security. True in some cases, not universally applicable.

spacemadness 3y ago

I hate to break it to you but people do exactly this in the form of grossly over-engineered solutions with fancy design docs that impress the right people at the right time.

mjr00 3y ago
That's why I said "true in some cases" Though in my 15+ year career as dev and dev manager I've only ever encountered one person who was intentionally building things poorly for job-related reasons. (Even then, that was for a company doing a federal government contract, so arguably building it in a way that encouraged expensive maintenance contracts was good for the business, in a perverse way.) I've seen a lot of overengineered solutions with fancy design docs but they've always come from a good place, genuinely thinking that the hot new tool X or architecture Y is going to solve all of the problems. I've built some poorly overengineered solutions myself. But even if that road of overengineered solutions leads to hell, it's at least paved with good intentions.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > Though in my 15+ year career as dev and dev manager I've only ever encountered one person who was intentionally building things poorly for job-related reasons. I agree, I've very rarely seen this done by individuals. However, I've often seen it done by teams.
- drewcoo 3y ago
  > thinking that the hot new tool X or architecture Y is going to solve all of the problems Wanting to use X and Y and finding a way to shoehorn them into usefulness is called "motivated reasoning." Does that look any different from "coming from a good place?" Heck, it could be both motivated reasoning and coming from a good place.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago

I guess we've had wildly different career paths. The VAST majority of developers I've worked with couldn't give 2 shits about the business (as they probably shouldn't - the biz doesn't give 2 shits about them). Most of them don't really care about self preservation, because if you're an IC - it's so much easier to get a job compared to a manager or a VP or an exec. But most of them just want to build new things and use the hottest framework or drive some overly complex design just for the sake of it. At the same time, there's bugs that actually effect customers that no one is working on, because no one has time for that because they're too busy re-writing something in some new language or framework or whatever...