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Union teachers in Massachusetts were among the worst. They used COVID to lobby hard to end the Massachusetts Comprehensive Assessment System (MCAS) standardize

Union teachers in Massachusetts were among the worst. They used COVID to lobby hard to end the Massachusetts Comprehensive Assessment System (MCAS) standardized tests. https://www.masslive.com/news/2020/08/mass-educators-urge-passage-of-controversial-bill-to-suspend-mcas-testing-for-four-years-saying-the-test-fails-low-income-students-and-students-of-color.html https://www.masslive.com/news/2020/08/mass-educators-urge-pa... Truly despicable.

singleshot_ 3y ago
I remember these tests. They were a real drag. Why was it despicable to get rid of them?
- BenFranklin100 3y ago
  The teacher’s union leadership wanted to cover up their tracks and hide objective measures of how harmful remote learning was to the Commonwealth’s children, including how it was especially harmful to poor minority children who lacked proper IT (laptops, reliable internet, etc…) and where many of whom many came from single parent households where the parent could not work from home. https://www.boston.com/news/coronavirus/2022/11/07/study-pandemic-learning-loss-may-cost-massachusetts-students-billions-in-future-earnings/ https://www.boston.com/news/coronavirus/2022/11/07/study-pan... As I said, despicable.
  - singleshot_ 3y ago
    We have our "despicableness" threshold set somewhat differently but no, that's not good at all. Thank you for explaining.
    - BenFranklin100 3y ago
      In my book, knowingly covering up harm to at-risk children from those tasked to helping them counts as ‘despicable. You do you though.
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
- NoRelToEmber 3y ago
  Another poster [1] gives the answer: their children's report cards looked great, and they had no idea how poorly they were doing until they got standardized test results. I'm sorry that they're a "drag", but standardized tests are the only way to tell if children are learning or if they're just being gifted grades, and the only way to compare children across different schools. As much as that article wants to blame them on racism, nearly every country in the world uses them, and there's a reason for that. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36425892 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36425892
  - singleshot_ 3y ago
    I wouldn't exactly say that standardized tests are the only way to judge, as GWB asked, "Is our children learning?" It would of course be possible to talk to a child and figure out if, for instance, they were illiterate. I agree that a standard test across schools would be a useful way to standardize or normalize the educational results of all the children. I'm not sure the juice is worth the squeeze. One other thing I'll mention is that it was SOP in our middle school to just answer randomly because there was no recourse to the individual student for low scores, and as soon as we were done with the test, we were released outside. This may have been addressed procedurally in the MCAS because I think I actually took a slightly older precursor which may have been called the MSAT. I think you can imagine how useful a test is if there's not any incentive to pass it. It might be possible that the reason the scores are dropping is because more and more children are realizing there is no reason (local to them) to score well on the test.
- froglets 3y ago
  Kids still take the MCAS in Mass, and it’s still a requirement to gradation. They actually raised the scores required to graduate just last year.
BeFlatXIII 3y ago
What incentives do students have to do well one the MCAS?
- ryathal 3y ago
  Students have little incentive, but the point is to have some measure of teacher success. The tests can also identify kids that may need intervention, which is some incentive to kids that don't need it to still do well on the test.

singleshot_ 3y ago

I remember these tests. They were a real drag. Why was it despicable to get rid of them?

BenFranklin100 3y ago
The teacher’s union leadership wanted to cover up their tracks and hide objective measures of how harmful remote learning was to the Commonwealth’s children, including how it was especially harmful to poor minority children who lacked proper IT (laptops, reliable internet, etc…) and where many of whom many came from single parent households where the parent could not work from home. https://www.boston.com/news/coronavirus/2022/11/07/study-pandemic-learning-loss-may-cost-massachusetts-students-billions-in-future-earnings/ https://www.boston.com/news/coronavirus/2022/11/07/study-pan... As I said, despicable.
- singleshot_ 3y ago
  We have our "despicableness" threshold set somewhat differently but no, that's not good at all. Thank you for explaining.
  - BenFranklin100 3y ago
    In my book, knowingly covering up harm to at-risk children from those tasked to helping them counts as ‘despicable. You do you though.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
NoRelToEmber 3y ago
Another poster [1] gives the answer: their children's report cards looked great, and they had no idea how poorly they were doing until they got standardized test results. I'm sorry that they're a "drag", but standardized tests are the only way to tell if children are learning or if they're just being gifted grades, and the only way to compare children across different schools. As much as that article wants to blame them on racism, nearly every country in the world uses them, and there's a reason for that. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36425892 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36425892
- singleshot_ 3y ago
  I wouldn't exactly say that standardized tests are the only way to judge, as GWB asked, "Is our children learning?" It would of course be possible to talk to a child and figure out if, for instance, they were illiterate. I agree that a standard test across schools would be a useful way to standardize or normalize the educational results of all the children. I'm not sure the juice is worth the squeeze. One other thing I'll mention is that it was SOP in our middle school to just answer randomly because there was no recourse to the individual student for low scores, and as soon as we were done with the test, we were released outside. This may have been addressed procedurally in the MCAS because I think I actually took a slightly older precursor which may have been called the MSAT. I think you can imagine how useful a test is if there's not any incentive to pass it. It might be possible that the reason the scores are dropping is because more and more children are realizing there is no reason (local to them) to score well on the test.
froglets 3y ago
Kids still take the MCAS in Mass, and it’s still a requirement to gradation. They actually raised the scores required to graduate just last year.

BeFlatXIII 3y ago

What incentives do students have to do well one the MCAS?

ryathal 3y ago
Students have little incentive, but the point is to have some measure of teacher success. The tests can also identify kids that may need intervention, which is some incentive to kids that don't need it to still do well on the test.