4 ms·

FSF's core principles cannot be defended if there's no one willing to defend them. RMS has been directly responsible for scaring away people from the core miss

FSF's core principles cannot be defended if there's no one willing to defend them. RMS has been directly responsible for scaring away people from the core mission of the FSF. Not just because of what other people have mentioned, but because he directly insults and threatens other individuals when he doesn't get his way. He's been doing this for decades now [1], long before anyone can claim the current furor is because of 'cancel culture' or whatever. And the end result is a more and more irrelevant FSF. [1] https://news.slashdot.org/story/12/12/23/1945248/gnu-grep-and-sed-maintainer-quits-rms-and-fsf-harming-gnu-project https://news.slashdot.org/story/12/12/23/1945248/gnu-grep-an...

dennis_jeeves1 3y ago
[flagged]
blueflow 3y ago
> but because he directly insults and threatens other individuals when he doesn't get his way. Given the last attempts to remove Stallman, I'm confident that he isn't alone in OSS having these traits.
- fzeroracer 3y ago
  The attempts to remove Stallman involved people bringing up stories and incidents of how awful he is to work with or even generally be nearby even beyond the most popular incidents. In turn, multiple open source and FSF organizations cut ties with him and the org when he came back to the FSF which is the whole 'you need people to defend the organization' problem comes from. And so the FSF becomes more irrelevant because they're more interested in the cult of personality rather than the actual principals of free software.
  - blueflow 3y ago
    Personally, i'd rather have RMS stay in place despite all of this than allowing a character assassination to work out. Because i consider the latter more awful. Edit: First commit of the rms-open-letter is by Molly de Blanc. TIL she is an ethics moralist like Coraline Ada Ehmke, which paints the whole RMS controversy in a new light.
    - fzeroracer 3y ago
      Then you have chosen for the FSF to die on the hill of the cult of RMS. You've clearly staked your ground and nothing can convince you otherwise, even though there are vast instances of the things RMS has said and done from people that have worked with him and around him. And I hope you realize the deep irony in you complaining about character assassination while you set out to do the same thing to try and prove an irrelevant point.
      - blueflow 3y ago
        Reciting her already public twitter bio is not character assassination.
        text0404 3y ago
        which is somehow different from reciting stallman's emails and public behavior? the latter being "character assassination"?
        blueflow 3y ago
        I mean what was written on https://rms-open-letter.github.io/ https://rms-open-letter.github.io/ : > Richard M. Stallman, frequently known as RMS, has been a dangerous force in the free software community for a long time. He has shown himself to be misogynist, ableist, and transphobic, among other serious accusations of impropriety. I think if someone wrote it themselves as a comment here on HN it would constitute flaming and would get flagged.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
  - esarbe 3y ago
    These complains are brought up by people that never actually worked with Stallman and are ridiculous nonsense. Why are you supporting and repeating such vile accusations that have repeatedly been debunked by people that actually worked with Stallman? https://whoisylvia.medium.com/richard-stallman-has-been-vilified-by-those-who-dont-know-him-a3907b25b4c7 https://whoisylvia.medium.com/richard-stallman-has-been-vili... https://meribold.org/2021/04/07/critique-of-rms-open-letter/ https://meribold.org/2021/04/07/critique-of-rms-open-letter/
shkkmo 3y ago
The story you link makes no mention of "insults or threats" and does not back up your claims.
- esarbe 3y ago
  Exactly. This claims are unfounded rumors spread by people that don't like RMS and want to see him gone. Not because there's actually any objectionable behavior from his side. Yes, I get it - he's weird. So what?!
esarbe 3y ago
> but because he directly insults and threatens other individuals when he doesn't get his way. Why do you spread this nonsensical rumors? The link you posted doesn't even reference whatever behavior your vilely imply - instead is all about "technical and administrative disagreements". If the FSF has a bad reputation, it's because of people like you spreading FUD about Richard Stallman's behavior and person. Why don't you stop with this crap and just take RMS as the kind and flawed human being he is?

dennis_jeeves1 3y ago

[flagged]

blueflow 3y ago

> but because he directly insults and threatens other individuals when he doesn't get his way. Given the last attempts to remove Stallman, I'm confident that he isn't alone in OSS having these traits.

fzeroracer 3y ago
The attempts to remove Stallman involved people bringing up stories and incidents of how awful he is to work with or even generally be nearby even beyond the most popular incidents. In turn, multiple open source and FSF organizations cut ties with him and the org when he came back to the FSF which is the whole 'you need people to defend the organization' problem comes from. And so the FSF becomes more irrelevant because they're more interested in the cult of personality rather than the actual principals of free software.
- blueflow 3y ago
  Personally, i'd rather have RMS stay in place despite all of this than allowing a character assassination to work out. Because i consider the latter more awful. Edit: First commit of the rms-open-letter is by Molly de Blanc. TIL she is an ethics moralist like Coraline Ada Ehmke, which paints the whole RMS controversy in a new light.
  - fzeroracer 3y ago
    Then you have chosen for the FSF to die on the hill of the cult of RMS. You've clearly staked your ground and nothing can convince you otherwise, even though there are vast instances of the things RMS has said and done from people that have worked with him and around him. And I hope you realize the deep irony in you complaining about character assassination while you set out to do the same thing to try and prove an irrelevant point.
    - blueflow 3y ago
      Reciting her already public twitter bio is not character assassination.
      - text0404 3y ago
        which is somehow different from reciting stallman's emails and public behavior? the latter being "character assassination"?
        blueflow 3y ago
        I mean what was written on https://rms-open-letter.github.io/ https://rms-open-letter.github.io/ : > Richard M. Stallman, frequently known as RMS, has been a dangerous force in the free software community for a long time. He has shown himself to be misogynist, ableist, and transphobic, among other serious accusations of impropriety. I think if someone wrote it themselves as a comment here on HN it would constitute flaming and would get flagged.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
- esarbe 3y ago
  These complains are brought up by people that never actually worked with Stallman and are ridiculous nonsense. Why are you supporting and repeating such vile accusations that have repeatedly been debunked by people that actually worked with Stallman? https://whoisylvia.medium.com/richard-stallman-has-been-vilified-by-those-who-dont-know-him-a3907b25b4c7 https://whoisylvia.medium.com/richard-stallman-has-been-vili... https://meribold.org/2021/04/07/critique-of-rms-open-letter/ https://meribold.org/2021/04/07/critique-of-rms-open-letter/

shkkmo 3y ago

The story you link makes no mention of "insults or threats" and does not back up your claims.

esarbe 3y ago
Exactly. This claims are unfounded rumors spread by people that don't like RMS and want to see him gone. Not because there's actually any objectionable behavior from his side. Yes, I get it - he's weird. So what?!

esarbe 3y ago

> but because he directly insults and threatens other individuals when he doesn't get his way. Why do you spread this nonsensical rumors? The link you posted doesn't even reference whatever behavior your vilely imply - instead is all about "technical and administrative disagreements". If the FSF has a bad reputation, it's because of people like you spreading FUD about Richard Stallman's behavior and person. Why don't you stop with this crap and just take RMS as the kind and flawed human being he is?