7 ms·

Reddit is trying to sow division in mod teams because the protest is working

109 points by st3fan 3y ago

itqwertz 3y ago
Change sems to seems in the intro paragraph.
somsak2 3y ago
really tired of this reddit play by play taking over HN. can we try to limit it to more substantive stories it possible? 3-4 things on the front page per day feels excessive.
- piva00 3y ago
  Pro-tip: you don't need to interact with whatever is on the front page, you can safely ignore what displeases you.
  - somsak2 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - piva00 3y ago
      I usually do, also I do recommend that you read the guidelines here before replying comments and/or submissions: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
      - somsak2 3y ago
        [flagged]
mindslight 3y ago
Trying to confront the Royal Court's ultimatum head on with some kind of written response seems like a losing proposition, because Reddit Inc ultimately controls the servers. Just as with most physical protests worth a damn, where it's just a matter of time until the police show up and break it up. The "malicious" compliance of /r/pics seems like the way to go. The subreddit is nominally available, the users are involved and showing support of the protest, a clear symbol has been chosen that shows the issue is not going to go away, and the subreddit is not operating with business as usual. An alternative approach for something like /r/firefox might be choosing a style sheet that was uncomfortable to read, maybe black text on black background, bright green text on pink background, or something like that. This would have the bonus effect of nudging users into using third party apps for accessibility's sake. They could even sticky a link to a third party app at the top of the subreddit, one that doesn't bow down to the API nonsense but rather functions through adversarial interoperability.
emu7652 3y ago
IMHO Reddit is going to confiscate closed subreddits and give it to mods that "better fit"
- throwawaylinux 3y ago
  Makes sense. Reddit moderators are even more deluded about where the site's value is than they portray its owners to be. It is certainly not in the moderation work, which many do to satisfy their need for power over others, and for each moderator there are 100 sycophants and narcissists lined up to take their place. The value is in the users, the people who create content. And to that end the freest, fairest, and most democratic choice is the individual's private decision to participate. Closing subs to protest takes that choice out of the hands of the user. Make organic posts to the site to raise awareness of any particular issue or cause you like, and let those get viewed and voted as they will. But using moderator powers to make these statements is an abuse of power and abuse of the user base, and it's exactly what I would expect from the archetype reddit moderator. I wouldn't be too upset to see a few get their comeuppance for it. I say this as someone who dislikes the reddit organization, the CEO, their lies and underhandedness, has been proudly perma banned from there, and would get some petty satisfaction from reading about them crashing and burning. But if people like it and want to use it and continue to participate in their communities they are a part of there, they should be permitted to.
  - 8note 3y ago
    The power-users and power-mods tend to overlap, so that's about the same group. People unhappy with moderator choices can do what they always did, make the community that matches what they want. > if people like it and want to use it and continue to participate ... Except the blind of course, or anyone else with accessibility needs. They'll be required to pay extra for access
    - wh0knows 3y ago
      Reddit already made an exception for accessibility focused apps, so your last statement is not accurate. For your first point, the moderators don’t own the subreddits they moderate, so the users should not have to attempt to recreate a community every time they encounter a power-tripping moderator. The moderators are stewards that are supposed to reflect the desires of the community, not owners who get to control the ability to use that community based on their whims.
robswc 3y ago
I think this can honestly be the nail in the coffin for Reddit as many people know it. I know it could easily be justified that it was “dead” years ago and the quality has only degraded over the years… but this really anchors things to the summer of 2023 being when things objectively changed in a big way. To be sure, Reddit itself will go on but only as a husk of its former self.
- pocketarc 3y ago
  Not yet - there isn't a suitable replacement yet. But this would've been the perfect time for a Reddit alternative. I think this will actually not change much for the users themselves. They'll continue using Reddit as normal, and move on. Mod teams will be shuffled, and some of the people using third-party apps (like myself) will just... not use Reddit as much (or at all). I also don't know how a multi-hundred-million-user platform can be justified as already "dead". It might be dead in some elitist sense, as in "oh, all the smart people like me aren't using it anymore", but...
  - Euphorbium 3y ago
    Tildes is a replacement I have chosen, it is a million times better.
    - theshrike79 3y ago
      It would be a nice replacement except for: > Tildes is currently in invite-only alpha, and you must be invited to be able to register. Most of the existing users have the ability to invite others
      - SkyPuncher 3y ago
        It’s not that hard to fish for an invite on HN. The fact that your on HN is likely a strong enough sign that you aren’t a troll/bad actor. I do not yet have invite abilities, but I’m sure you can find someone here that does.
    - 3y ago
user249 3y ago
The reddit mods are little tyrants in my experience. I hope the one's that think they own reddit get booted. Really, some of them are awful people. I wish I were trolling but I'm not. They can try to get their users to follow them somewhere else but it will fail because they are behaving unreasonably and breaking a site we all like, which has never been a big money maker. The mods belong in r/choosingbeggers for acting like it should be free
- DANmode 3y ago
  > which has never been a big money maker. What are you on about, here?
  - user249 3y ago
    Reddit has never made a lot of money. AI companies scrapped all their data for free which wasn't fair. So they start charging to support the site. I don't see how reddit owners are in the wrong here. But mods are behaving as expected, like petulant children.
    - anaganisk 3y ago
      Dude the top AI company, "Open"AI, founded by Sam Altman is a board member of reddit, I'm all for conspiracy but at least get the basics right. I myself have a conspiracy theory that he is pressuring Reddit to build a moat. Also disallowing API access does shit, to stop API companies from scraping anyway, because they can still scrape off the site like how search engines do it, so even my conspiracy may only be true to certain extent. Also mods are volunteers, they keep the community conformant to the sub rules, mods who don't watch their content will lead to comments like "Why is this on this sub", "sub has gone to shit", there are people who genuinely take care of their subreddit. They're kind of unpaid janitors.
      - user249 3y ago
        > Sam Altman is a board member of reddit Well then, he's acting responsibly by not letting every other AI company have the data for free. I'm not impugning all mods. I appreciate their work. But some let the power go to their heads
greenshift 3y ago
[flagged]
- aaomidi 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - greenshift 3y ago
    [flagged]
- flangola7 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - postalrat 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - greenshift 3y ago
    [flagged]
pyuser583 3y ago
It’s Reddits platform. There’s no way to beat them other than leaving.
- TMWNN 3y ago
  The most bizarre thing is how any mods could ever have thought that an indefinite blackout would possibly result in a win for them. Reddit, the company, had and has 100% of the power. At least workers on strike can march with signs around the factory and try to block replacements from entering. Mods have zero, zilch, zip power to prevent Reddit from doing whatever it wants with subreddits and mods' accounts. Is it bloated egos from having had "infinite" authority (as long as they obeyed Redditwide rules) over hundreds of thousands or millions of other people during their visits to the mods' fiefdom of a subreddit? Or mental illness? My answer: `whynotboth.gif`
  - worrycue 3y ago
    Frankly, some moderators who actually moderate out of altruism will probably quit and leave the subreddit to its fate - after all its just an Internet forum.* That will leave just the power hungry loons. * Reddit probably suffers from the same sort of delusion that Twitter does in that its True Believers believe that the whole world is participating in their platform when it’s only a small fraction of the human population.
- Gigachad 3y ago
  The current protests are significantly devaluing it. Most of my favourite subs are still private, restricted, or are just being spammed with junk.
theshrike79 3y ago
/r/pics is now just pics of John Oliver after they were forced to open. They are open, people can post pics but mods will remove everything that's not John Oliver. Same with /r/gifs /r/steam was forced open and they'll most likely pivot to posting pictures of actual steam.
- Gigachad 3y ago
  Just checked and steam is now pictures of actual steam.
- joshstrange 3y ago
  And believe /r/art is now painted pictures of John Oliver only. I find it hilarious but at the same time I’m not sure how long it will be sustainable. I’m pretty sure I’m leaving Reddit after 10+ years at the end of the month when my client dies so I don’t care but the people staying are going to get tired of that after a while. Not to mention I don’t know if Reddit really cares as long as it drives traffic.

109 points by st3fan 3y ago

Change sems to seems in the intro paragraph.

really tired of this reddit play by play taking over HN. can we try to limit it to more substantive stories it possible? 3-4 things on the front page per day feels excessive.

piva00 3y ago
Pro-tip: you don't need to interact with whatever is on the front page, you can safely ignore what displeases you.
- somsak2 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - piva00 3y ago
    I usually do, also I do recommend that you read the guidelines here before replying comments and/or submissions: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
    - somsak2 3y ago
      [flagged]

mindslight 3y ago

Trying to confront the Royal Court's ultimatum head on with some kind of written response seems like a losing proposition, because Reddit Inc ultimately controls the servers. Just as with most physical protests worth a damn, where it's just a matter of time until the police show up and break it up. The "malicious" compliance of /r/pics seems like the way to go. The subreddit is nominally available, the users are involved and showing support of the protest, a clear symbol has been chosen that shows the issue is not going to go away, and the subreddit is not operating with business as usual. An alternative approach for something like /r/firefox might be choosing a style sheet that was uncomfortable to read, maybe black text on black background, bright green text on pink background, or something like that. This would have the bonus effect of nudging users into using third party apps for accessibility's sake. They could even sticky a link to a third party app at the top of the subreddit, one that doesn't bow down to the API nonsense but rather functions through adversarial interoperability.

emu7652 3y ago

IMHO Reddit is going to confiscate closed subreddits and give it to mods that "better fit"

throwawaylinux 3y ago
Makes sense. Reddit moderators are even more deluded about where the site's value is than they portray its owners to be. It is certainly not in the moderation work, which many do to satisfy their need for power over others, and for each moderator there are 100 sycophants and narcissists lined up to take their place. The value is in the users, the people who create content. And to that end the freest, fairest, and most democratic choice is the individual's private decision to participate. Closing subs to protest takes that choice out of the hands of the user. Make organic posts to the site to raise awareness of any particular issue or cause you like, and let those get viewed and voted as they will. But using moderator powers to make these statements is an abuse of power and abuse of the user base, and it's exactly what I would expect from the archetype reddit moderator. I wouldn't be too upset to see a few get their comeuppance for it. I say this as someone who dislikes the reddit organization, the CEO, their lies and underhandedness, has been proudly perma banned from there, and would get some petty satisfaction from reading about them crashing and burning. But if people like it and want to use it and continue to participate in their communities they are a part of there, they should be permitted to.
- 8note 3y ago
  The power-users and power-mods tend to overlap, so that's about the same group. People unhappy with moderator choices can do what they always did, make the community that matches what they want. > if people like it and want to use it and continue to participate ... Except the blind of course, or anyone else with accessibility needs. They'll be required to pay extra for access
  - wh0knows 3y ago
    Reddit already made an exception for accessibility focused apps, so your last statement is not accurate. For your first point, the moderators don’t own the subreddits they moderate, so the users should not have to attempt to recreate a community every time they encounter a power-tripping moderator. The moderators are stewards that are supposed to reflect the desires of the community, not owners who get to control the ability to use that community based on their whims.

robswc 3y ago

I think this can honestly be the nail in the coffin for Reddit as many people know it. I know it could easily be justified that it was “dead” years ago and the quality has only degraded over the years… but this really anchors things to the summer of 2023 being when things objectively changed in a big way. To be sure, Reddit itself will go on but only as a husk of its former self.

pocketarc 3y ago
Not yet - there isn't a suitable replacement yet. But this would've been the perfect time for a Reddit alternative. I think this will actually not change much for the users themselves. They'll continue using Reddit as normal, and move on. Mod teams will be shuffled, and some of the people using third-party apps (like myself) will just... not use Reddit as much (or at all). I also don't know how a multi-hundred-million-user platform can be justified as already "dead". It might be dead in some elitist sense, as in "oh, all the smart people like me aren't using it anymore", but...
- Euphorbium 3y ago
  Tildes is a replacement I have chosen, it is a million times better.
  - theshrike79 3y ago
    It would be a nice replacement except for: > Tildes is currently in invite-only alpha, and you must be invited to be able to register. Most of the existing users have the ability to invite others
    - SkyPuncher 3y ago
      It’s not that hard to fish for an invite on HN. The fact that your on HN is likely a strong enough sign that you aren’t a troll/bad actor. I do not yet have invite abilities, but I’m sure you can find someone here that does.
  - 3y ago

user249 3y ago

The reddit mods are little tyrants in my experience. I hope the one's that think they own reddit get booted. Really, some of them are awful people. I wish I were trolling but I'm not. They can try to get their users to follow them somewhere else but it will fail because they are behaving unreasonably and breaking a site we all like, which has never been a big money maker. The mods belong in r/choosingbeggers for acting like it should be free

DANmode 3y ago
> which has never been a big money maker. What are you on about, here?
- user249 3y ago
  Reddit has never made a lot of money. AI companies scrapped all their data for free which wasn't fair. So they start charging to support the site. I don't see how reddit owners are in the wrong here. But mods are behaving as expected, like petulant children.
  - anaganisk 3y ago
    Dude the top AI company, "Open"AI, founded by Sam Altman is a board member of reddit, I'm all for conspiracy but at least get the basics right. I myself have a conspiracy theory that he is pressuring Reddit to build a moat. Also disallowing API access does shit, to stop API companies from scraping anyway, because they can still scrape off the site like how search engines do it, so even my conspiracy may only be true to certain extent. Also mods are volunteers, they keep the community conformant to the sub rules, mods who don't watch their content will lead to comments like "Why is this on this sub", "sub has gone to shit", there are people who genuinely take care of their subreddit. They're kind of unpaid janitors.
    - user249 3y ago
      > Sam Altman is a board member of reddit Well then, he's acting responsibly by not letting every other AI company have the data for free. I'm not impugning all mods. I appreciate their work. But some let the power go to their heads

greenshift 3y ago

[flagged]

aaomidi 3y ago
[flagged]
- greenshift 3y ago
  [flagged]
flangola7 3y ago
[flagged]
- postalrat 3y ago
  [flagged]
- greenshift 3y ago
  [flagged]

pyuser583 3y ago

It’s Reddits platform. There’s no way to beat them other than leaving.

TMWNN 3y ago
The most bizarre thing is how any mods could ever have thought that an indefinite blackout would possibly result in a win for them. Reddit, the company, had and has 100% of the power. At least workers on strike can march with signs around the factory and try to block replacements from entering. Mods have zero, zilch, zip power to prevent Reddit from doing whatever it wants with subreddits and mods' accounts. Is it bloated egos from having had "infinite" authority (as long as they obeyed Redditwide rules) over hundreds of thousands or millions of other people during their visits to the mods' fiefdom of a subreddit? Or mental illness? My answer: `whynotboth.gif`
- worrycue 3y ago
  Frankly, some moderators who actually moderate out of altruism will probably quit and leave the subreddit to its fate - after all its just an Internet forum.* That will leave just the power hungry loons. * Reddit probably suffers from the same sort of delusion that Twitter does in that its True Believers believe that the whole world is participating in their platform when it’s only a small fraction of the human population.
Gigachad 3y ago
The current protests are significantly devaluing it. Most of my favourite subs are still private, restricted, or are just being spammed with junk.

theshrike79 3y ago

/r/pics is now just pics of John Oliver after they were forced to open. They are open, people can post pics but mods will remove everything that's not John Oliver. Same with /r/gifs /r/steam was forced open and they'll most likely pivot to posting pictures of actual steam.

Gigachad 3y ago
Just checked and steam is now pictures of actual steam.
joshstrange 3y ago
And believe /r/art is now painted pictures of John Oliver only. I find it hilarious but at the same time I’m not sure how long it will be sustainable. I’m pretty sure I’m leaving Reddit after 10+ years at the end of the month when my client dies so I don’t care but the people staying are going to get tired of that after a while. Not to mention I don’t know if Reddit really cares as long as it drives traffic.