3 ms·

This is worst docker image ever. It's starting multiple minutes. You're supposed to "compile" it, creating your own image, hosting it somewhere (and it's huge

This is worst docker image ever. It's starting multiple minutes. You're supposed to "compile" it, creating your own image, hosting it somewhere (and it's huge). And then this "compiled" image will be fast. Well, fast in Java terms.

chromatin 3y ago
Agree I was shocked when I read the instructions and realized I had to build a secondary container. On top of this, there are some keycloak options (parameters and env vars) which are valid only at the time of compiling a new container, where others are valid only at runtime
- faangsticle 3y ago
  You absolutely don't have to build a container. You can, and it makes startup a few seconds faster so they recommend it, since it's hardly a pain anyway if you already have CI in place. Anyway, they changed the default behavior a few releases ago. In the past you had to pass --auto-build to avoid having to build, but now the default behavior is to auto build. If you instead want to optimize you have to do extra steps: https://www.keycloak.org/server/configuration https://www.keycloak.org/server/configuration
  - chromatin 3y ago
    That's great to hear -- thank you for the update!
nine_k 3y ago
If you `docker pull` an image, you already "host" it. It's a bunch of local files right on your machine. Starting a few minutes? It looks like there must be some DNS problem somewhere. Or maybe it's the download build time? In any case, I'd measure the second startup time. Java can be blazingly fast if done right. (And C++ can be stupidly slow if done wrong.)
- technion 3y ago
  I'm aware Java can be fast, but thats never what I work with. The products I've supported include vmware vcenter, confluence and epo. In all cases, just restarting a service is a "go have a coffee" affair. It really says a lot that something can take longer than a Microsoft exchange server to start but when I see it, I know someone badly wrote a Java app. To be clear I'll happily buy that this is a case of it not done right, but that seems pervasive.
  - re-thc 3y ago
    It says more about the era than Java. Those services were all built to not be restarted so they've never optimized for it. More recent Java frameworks and projects do try to optimize restarts due to kubernetes adoption etc.
    - 5e92cb50239222b 3y ago
      Every newer Java application I've seen is just as dog slow as those older ones. Keycloak itself being a prime example — it was rewritten on top of Quarkus recently, and it didn't help much. You're still expected to build a second image (and maintain it — it wouldn't be a problem if you only had to it once), and it still takes 2-3 minutes to become responsive. You may have have seen those magical Java applications that both implement a decent amount of functionality (so not just a toy), and start in a couple of seconds, but the rest of us will believe it when we see it. I wonder how they're developed, it feels like a throwback to the punch-card era. While I don't have much love for Microsoft, you should take a look at dotnet. Applications written on top of dotnet (even using massive frameworks like ASP.NET + EF) actually do start in a few seconds, which is at least an order of magnitude faster than anything similar in Java.

chromatin 3y ago

Agree I was shocked when I read the instructions and realized I had to build a secondary container. On top of this, there are some keycloak options (parameters and env vars) which are valid only at the time of compiling a new container, where others are valid only at runtime

faangsticle 3y ago
You absolutely don't have to build a container. You can, and it makes startup a few seconds faster so they recommend it, since it's hardly a pain anyway if you already have CI in place. Anyway, they changed the default behavior a few releases ago. In the past you had to pass --auto-build to avoid having to build, but now the default behavior is to auto build. If you instead want to optimize you have to do extra steps: https://www.keycloak.org/server/configuration https://www.keycloak.org/server/configuration
- chromatin 3y ago
  That's great to hear -- thank you for the update!

nine_k 3y ago

If you `docker pull` an image, you already "host" it. It's a bunch of local files right on your machine. Starting a few minutes? It looks like there must be some DNS problem somewhere. Or maybe it's the download build time? In any case, I'd measure the second startup time. Java can be blazingly fast if done right. (And C++ can be stupidly slow if done wrong.)

technion 3y ago
I'm aware Java can be fast, but thats never what I work with. The products I've supported include vmware vcenter, confluence and epo. In all cases, just restarting a service is a "go have a coffee" affair. It really says a lot that something can take longer than a Microsoft exchange server to start but when I see it, I know someone badly wrote a Java app. To be clear I'll happily buy that this is a case of it not done right, but that seems pervasive.
- re-thc 3y ago
  It says more about the era than Java. Those services were all built to not be restarted so they've never optimized for it. More recent Java frameworks and projects do try to optimize restarts due to kubernetes adoption etc.
  - 5e92cb50239222b 3y ago
    Every newer Java application I've seen is just as dog slow as those older ones. Keycloak itself being a prime example — it was rewritten on top of Quarkus recently, and it didn't help much. You're still expected to build a second image (and maintain it — it wouldn't be a problem if you only had to it once), and it still takes 2-3 minutes to become responsive. You may have have seen those magical Java applications that both implement a decent amount of functionality (so not just a toy), and start in a couple of seconds, but the rest of us will believe it when we see it. I wonder how they're developed, it feels like a throwback to the punch-card era. While I don't have much love for Microsoft, you should take a look at dotnet. Applications written on top of dotnet (even using massive frameworks like ASP.NET + EF) actually do start in a few seconds, which is at least an order of magnitude faster than anything similar in Java.