4 ms·

I think you read a different article. Miguel is aggrieved by the fact that it is no longer a developer focused company, which was the reason for its success. S

I think you read a different article. Miguel is aggrieved by the fact that it is no longer a developer focused company, which was the reason for its success. Sure, you need sales, marketing and the rest of it; it does not mean that you need to forget what made you great in the first place.

OJFord 3y ago
I agree; to make the point clearer: you can be a company full of salesmen etc. and still be focussed on engineers as the target market.
Solvency 3y ago
The article is all over the place. Miguel spends most of it bemoaning the change of his favorite billboard, as if that can be universally unpacked and extrapolated by others as why Twilio is no longer "for developers". The remainder of his post says only that their shift from focusing on one specialization (communications) to another (customer data and engagement) doesn't align with HIS values. Now, that's ok. He doesn't have to be down for it. But it also doesn't prove how they're no longer for developers. They could still have the best API, documentation, and developer support in the game. They could pay developers well, respect their input, and their process. And yet he doesn't speak to any of this. I want to know how Twilio is no longer for developers. What actually changed! That was his root proposition, and he doesn't address it or substantiate it ever.
- WWLink 3y ago
  " The article is all over the place. Miguel spends most of it bemoaning the change of his favorite billboard, as if that can be universally unpacked and extrapolated by others as why Twilio is no longer "for developers"." I think his point is hella clear with the two screenshots. Originally they provide "Voice, SMS, and Video APIs"and then they switch to "Customer Engagement Platform" Both messages are likely nonsense for the vast majority of people that drive by them. The "ask your developer" one specifically targets software devs and mentions why. The "How can I reduce acquisition costs by 65%?" targets business owners ... but it's a little vague because the first thing I'd think when I hear "acquisition costs" is buying another business lol. What the hell is a "customer engagement platform"? Well, a developer isn't gonna give a shit then. So the first billboard goes with a "hey boss I found out about this cool twillo stuff we can use!" to "Hi it's the CEO, we're now going to use twillo and if you don't like it, eat shit"
mbesto 3y ago
Rubbish. Money doesn't magically show up at your doorstep even if your product is focused on developers. How do you think SaaS companies are able to hire developers? Do those $350k bay area salaries magically come from nothing? Yes, they often initially fueled by VC dollars, but eventually customer revenues pay for them. The "anti sales" drivel from engineers on HN who are largely some of the highest paid positions in the world always puzzles me. It's OKAY to be okay with Sales & Marketing in companies. It isn't some evil function, and discounting it means future entrepreneurs are doomed to fail.
- wpietri 3y ago
  You are arguing with something that was not said. Neither the original article nor the person you are replying to said that sales wasn't needed. Indeed, the person you're replying to explicitly said the opposite. The actual complaint is that they shifted their target audience from engineers to something much broader and fuzzier. The complaint is not that they have salespeople, which they needed in either case. It's that the lack of clarity in who they're selling to and why is making it worse for everybody.
anaganisk 3y ago
I think I can play both sides, GIMP vs Photoshop, Photoshop Vs GIMP. Both have great engineers but sales and marketing is subject to opinion based on how you see them.

OJFord 3y ago

I agree; to make the point clearer: you can be a company full of salesmen etc. and still be focussed on engineers as the target market.

Solvency 3y ago

The article is all over the place. Miguel spends most of it bemoaning the change of his favorite billboard, as if that can be universally unpacked and extrapolated by others as why Twilio is no longer "for developers". The remainder of his post says only that their shift from focusing on one specialization (communications) to another (customer data and engagement) doesn't align with HIS values. Now, that's ok. He doesn't have to be down for it. But it also doesn't prove how they're no longer for developers. They could still have the best API, documentation, and developer support in the game. They could pay developers well, respect their input, and their process. And yet he doesn't speak to any of this. I want to know how Twilio is no longer for developers. What actually changed! That was his root proposition, and he doesn't address it or substantiate it ever.

WWLink 3y ago
" The article is all over the place. Miguel spends most of it bemoaning the change of his favorite billboard, as if that can be universally unpacked and extrapolated by others as why Twilio is no longer "for developers"." I think his point is hella clear with the two screenshots. Originally they provide "Voice, SMS, and Video APIs"and then they switch to "Customer Engagement Platform" Both messages are likely nonsense for the vast majority of people that drive by them. The "ask your developer" one specifically targets software devs and mentions why. The "How can I reduce acquisition costs by 65%?" targets business owners ... but it's a little vague because the first thing I'd think when I hear "acquisition costs" is buying another business lol. What the hell is a "customer engagement platform"? Well, a developer isn't gonna give a shit then. So the first billboard goes with a "hey boss I found out about this cool twillo stuff we can use!" to "Hi it's the CEO, we're now going to use twillo and if you don't like it, eat shit"

mbesto 3y ago

Rubbish. Money doesn't magically show up at your doorstep even if your product is focused on developers. How do you think SaaS companies are able to hire developers? Do those $350k bay area salaries magically come from nothing? Yes, they often initially fueled by VC dollars, but eventually customer revenues pay for them. The "anti sales" drivel from engineers on HN who are largely some of the highest paid positions in the world always puzzles me. It's OKAY to be okay with Sales & Marketing in companies. It isn't some evil function, and discounting it means future entrepreneurs are doomed to fail.

wpietri 3y ago
You are arguing with something that was not said. Neither the original article nor the person you are replying to said that sales wasn't needed. Indeed, the person you're replying to explicitly said the opposite. The actual complaint is that they shifted their target audience from engineers to something much broader and fuzzier. The complaint is not that they have salespeople, which they needed in either case. It's that the lack of clarity in who they're selling to and why is making it worse for everybody.

anaganisk 3y ago

I think I can play both sides, GIMP vs Photoshop, Photoshop Vs GIMP. Both have great engineers but sales and marketing is subject to opinion based on how you see them.