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It takes like 10 minutes for you to go look at the Lemmy.ml instance and see what's going on there. Someone else linked to the GitHub project and said just cli

It takes like 10 minutes for you to go look at the Lemmy.ml instance and see what's going on there. Someone else linked to the GitHub project and said just click on some of their profiles. You'll see it right away. You can ask for sources if you're curious, that's understandable, but it seems to me more like you're just trying to discredit here. Anyone reading this, I urge you, go to lemmy.ML, look at one of the threads they have about China. > To punish them in one area because of political views in another is another toxic manifestation of cancel culture. More like basic common sense. Are you going to trust people who support authoritarian censorship with the open source platform you speak on? That would be as silly as trusting the NSA to build it. There is a fundamental and irreconcilable conflict of interest there. This isn't punishing someone in one area because of their views in another, this is an area in which those views are simply not acceptable at all.

barbazoo 3y ago
> Are you going to trust people who support authoritarian censorship with the open source platform you speak on? Couldn't you just avoid that particular instance then?
- bioemerl 3y ago
  Yes, you could, if you want to also audit their code base and maintain their code base going into the future indefinitely.
  - jrflowers 3y ago
    What is your current system to make sure that the code that you run on your machine isn’t politically totalitarian?
    - bioemerl 3y ago
      You're asking this in bad faith, but... First off, I'm opting to not use Lemmy. I've swapped my whole computer stack except for one gaming PC to Linux. I adamantly avoid any hardware whose stack is owned by anyone in China, and I run a pretty tight ship when it comes to my firewall and networking. Next on my list is getting my phone de googled.
      - jrflowers 3y ago
        There isn’t any response to your point that can’t easily be deflected as being in “bad faith” because your own argument is an emotional appeal. Your position is that the people you despise are so bad that their code is itself tainted to the extent that even running it runs the risk of… genocide or something? In order to achieve a purity in your view would require a line-by-line political Bill Of Materials that includes the political beliefs at the time of the coders at time of each commit. It is nonsensical.
        bioemerl 3y ago
        > Your position is that the people you despise are so bad that Well, no, I've given a very specific and reasonable reason. They support authoritarian censorship and control, states that perform authoritarian censorship and control. They're trying to run an open message platform. It's not just because they're bad people, it's because they support states that are involved in the active censorship of speech. You're trusting them with a message platform that's supposed to promote free speech. It's not emotional, that's not just them being bad. It is a hilarious and obvious conflict of interest. > code is itself tainted Yeah. If you can't trust the authors you can't trust the code. You can perform a audit on it, you can create a team that maintains it as a fork, and at that point it's safe. Unless you're willing to do that work, and nobody's willing to do that work, it's not safe. > In order to achieve a purity in your view would require a line-by-line political Bill Of Materials that includes the political beliefs at the time of the coders at time of each commit. It is nonsensical. No, I just don't want the developers to be obvious and blatant supporters of what are basically fascist nations. If they really love mixed housing developments I don't really care. It's not about their politics, it's about the fact that they have specifically very extreme politics that are a conflict of interest with the very software they're developing.
        jrflowers 3y ago
        > No, I just don't want the developers to be obvious and blatant supporters of what are basically fascist nations. Why did you use the words “blatant” and “obvious” in this sentence?
26fingies 3y ago
The lemmy.ml authors appear to be communists. Their ideology and support of China doesn’t mean they are somehow funded or corrupted by China. That is an irrational and conspiratorial line of thought. Or would you prefer to ban communists and their ideas from the internet? What would that make you?
- bioemerl 3y ago
  I never said they are funded by China. I didn't say but they were corrupted by them either. I also didn't say they should be banned from the internet. You basically invented three things that I never said here. I said they support China, and implicitly support the sort of authoritarian control that China represents. That authoritarian control is fundamentally incompatible with open source, and free speech, and democracy, and most human rights. If you support any of those things you would be a fool to support Lemmy.
  - 26fingies 3y ago
    I think you’re going to have to be more specific with what you mean by “authoritarian control” because I have a feeling that there are some fundamental differences between the way China operates and the way an open source message board project operates.
    - bioemerl 3y ago
      Authoritarian control. The Chinese government reserves the right to ban censor and shut down any form of online speech going on in the country. In fact, they reserve the right to throw you in jail for doing it. Where is ever an event or a situation or a topic of discussion which the state does not like they flip a couple of switches and all across the country firewalls begin blocking words, banning access to VPNs, and generally preventing those topics from being able to be discussed. They believe this is good because it promotes social stability, when in reality it's just a massive system that empowers the government and ensures that the people can never easily disagree with it. Anyone who supports such a system or a country who runs such a system should not be running and open source message board.
9991 3y ago
OK, I briefly looked at posts on Lemmy.ml. I saw nothing about China or communism. But so what if it is there? Other people posting on a particular instance doesn't reflect at all on the Lemmy code or project. Is it so hard to link to something specific and offensive the authors themselves wrote or did?

barbazoo 3y ago

> Are you going to trust people who support authoritarian censorship with the open source platform you speak on? Couldn't you just avoid that particular instance then?

bioemerl 3y ago
Yes, you could, if you want to also audit their code base and maintain their code base going into the future indefinitely.
- jrflowers 3y ago
  What is your current system to make sure that the code that you run on your machine isn’t politically totalitarian?
  - bioemerl 3y ago
    You're asking this in bad faith, but... First off, I'm opting to not use Lemmy. I've swapped my whole computer stack except for one gaming PC to Linux. I adamantly avoid any hardware whose stack is owned by anyone in China, and I run a pretty tight ship when it comes to my firewall and networking. Next on my list is getting my phone de googled.
    - jrflowers 3y ago
      There isn’t any response to your point that can’t easily be deflected as being in “bad faith” because your own argument is an emotional appeal. Your position is that the people you despise are so bad that their code is itself tainted to the extent that even running it runs the risk of… genocide or something? In order to achieve a purity in your view would require a line-by-line political Bill Of Materials that includes the political beliefs at the time of the coders at time of each commit. It is nonsensical.
      - bioemerl 3y ago
        > Your position is that the people you despise are so bad that Well, no, I've given a very specific and reasonable reason. They support authoritarian censorship and control, states that perform authoritarian censorship and control. They're trying to run an open message platform. It's not just because they're bad people, it's because they support states that are involved in the active censorship of speech. You're trusting them with a message platform that's supposed to promote free speech. It's not emotional, that's not just them being bad. It is a hilarious and obvious conflict of interest. > code is itself tainted Yeah. If you can't trust the authors you can't trust the code. You can perform a audit on it, you can create a team that maintains it as a fork, and at that point it's safe. Unless you're willing to do that work, and nobody's willing to do that work, it's not safe. > In order to achieve a purity in your view would require a line-by-line political Bill Of Materials that includes the political beliefs at the time of the coders at time of each commit. It is nonsensical. No, I just don't want the developers to be obvious and blatant supporters of what are basically fascist nations. If they really love mixed housing developments I don't really care. It's not about their politics, it's about the fact that they have specifically very extreme politics that are a conflict of interest with the very software they're developing.
        jrflowers 3y ago
        > No, I just don't want the developers to be obvious and blatant supporters of what are basically fascist nations. Why did you use the words “blatant” and “obvious” in this sentence?

26fingies 3y ago

The lemmy.ml authors appear to be communists. Their ideology and support of China doesn’t mean they are somehow funded or corrupted by China. That is an irrational and conspiratorial line of thought. Or would you prefer to ban communists and their ideas from the internet? What would that make you?

bioemerl 3y ago
I never said they are funded by China. I didn't say but they were corrupted by them either. I also didn't say they should be banned from the internet. You basically invented three things that I never said here. I said they support China, and implicitly support the sort of authoritarian control that China represents. That authoritarian control is fundamentally incompatible with open source, and free speech, and democracy, and most human rights. If you support any of those things you would be a fool to support Lemmy.
- 26fingies 3y ago
  I think you’re going to have to be more specific with what you mean by “authoritarian control” because I have a feeling that there are some fundamental differences between the way China operates and the way an open source message board project operates.
  - bioemerl 3y ago
    Authoritarian control. The Chinese government reserves the right to ban censor and shut down any form of online speech going on in the country. In fact, they reserve the right to throw you in jail for doing it. Where is ever an event or a situation or a topic of discussion which the state does not like they flip a couple of switches and all across the country firewalls begin blocking words, banning access to VPNs, and generally preventing those topics from being able to be discussed. They believe this is good because it promotes social stability, when in reality it's just a massive system that empowers the government and ensures that the people can never easily disagree with it. Anyone who supports such a system or a country who runs such a system should not be running and open source message board.

9991 3y ago

OK, I briefly looked at posts on Lemmy.ml. I saw nothing about China or communism. But so what if it is there? Other people posting on a particular instance doesn't reflect at all on the Lemmy code or project. Is it so hard to link to something specific and offensive the authors themselves wrote or did?