That is a very insightful comment, thank you for making it. I think I understand your original point a little better than I did. > To think ourselves as civili

That is a very insightful comment, thank you for making it. I think I understand your original point a little better than I did. > To think ourselves as civilized because we repress those urges into complete subjugation is foolhardy. Given your belief about the existence of inherent brutality in humanity (which I agree with) is a "civilized person" actually an achievable goal? I have gone this far believing that the definition of a "civilized" person is some with normal, inherent uncivilized urges that effectively controls ("subjugates") those urges enough to create civilization. (Peace and prosperity via collaboration and material surplus.) Also, if exile to prison is not actually solving any long-term problems, what do you think is a possibile course of action that does address long-term problems?