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The Reddit wars have begun. Users were misled to believe they have power. And now are completely bewildered when they realize they don’t have as much power as t

The Reddit wars have begun. Users were misled to believe they have power. And now are completely bewildered when they realize they don’t have as much power as they thought. The funny thing is that this is all over a stupid API that was causing more harm to Reddit than it was functioning as a public service. Apps were functioning as alternatives to the Reddit website and app. The whole thing about API back in 2000s is it allows users to interface with Reddit programmably. Remember the first Web3.0? Who would have thought it would be used to create an entirely alternate app market? Every platform eventually pivots to paid APIs. Twitter did a long time back by buying all of the alt apps. Lesson: APIs are expensive to maintain and no real P̶r̶o̶f̶i̶t̶a̶b̶l̶e̶ (edit: profit-driven) business is going to keep them around unselfishly.

telmo 3y ago
> Users were misled to believe they have power. And now are completely bewildered when they realize they don’t have as much power as they thought. First of all: if Reddit really is doing this, then it is committing an illegal act. At least in the EU, I'm sure in other jurisdictions also. There are in fact laws protecting the users. Second of all: Reddit cannot force users to post and moderate, and without those things there is no Reddit. Have you heard of Digg, by any chance? > The funny thing is that this is all over a stupid API that was causing more harm to Reddit than it was functioning as a public service. It was absolutely functioning as a public service, because third-party apps are the only ones that are actually usable. Especially so for moderator activities (that Reddit depends on to exist) and even more especially so for blind people, to whom Reddit official app does not cater. Do you know what else functions as a public service? Unpaid moderators! > The whole thing about API back in 2000s is it allows users to interface with Reddit programmably. I remember those times very well, and that was not "the whole thing" at all, there was a "bait and switch" from independent forums to centralized services based on a promise of openness forever. But I digress. Who cares what the "whole thing was about back in 2000s"? It doesn't matter what it was about, the only thing that matters is what the situation is now, and the situation is that Reddit as we know it is an interdependent partnership between a company and an extensive international community. This is what survived to 2023 and this is what matters in 2023. > Lesson: APIs are expensive to maintain and no real profitable business is going to keep them around unselfishly. Another lesson: a profitable business cannot extract value from the unpaid work of enthusiasts while at the same time expecting to be able to treat said enthusiasts as valueless replaceable cogs.
- bunga-bunga 3y ago
  I think your thoughts are completely off. Removing users from power is definitely not illegal. Digg lost because they changed the website, Reddit has not changed here. > third-party apps are the only ones that are actually usable In your opinion. Millions of users just use the site and official app. > valueless replaceable cogs. Which they are. Plenty of mods are ready to take care of popular subreddits. Some users will be lost, but they are the minority. The only mistake Reddit is making is by waiting too long to reign in the popular subreddits and allowing people to protest on Reddit’s own homepage.
  - telmo 3y ago
    > I think your thoughts are completely off. Removing users from power is definitely not illegal. Yes, but restoring user generated content that was deleted by the creator without their consent is. That is what we are talking about here. You seem to have a crystal ball and know the future, so who am I to argue.
xaitv 3y ago
I think the current pricing of Reddit's API isn't meant to recoup costs of maintaining the API, it's meant to kill 3rd party apps so people switch to the official app, which shows ads. It's not so much the cost of maintaining the API than it is the cost of missed ad revenue.
- krisoft 3y ago
  > it is the cost of missed ad revenue. Then ask for that, similar to youtube red? You estimate how much each person would net you in ad revenue and ask them to contribute that much. It could be phrased as "do you like reddit? contribute to its upkeep."
- justin66 3y ago
  Wouldn't it have made sense for Reddit to get the official app in some kind of shape, with all the needed accessibility features and moderator controls, before killing third party apps? They just seem to be doing things out of order. Another example: alienate long-time users and mods by making it abundantly clear that they're product and free labor really should have come after the IPO.
  - BonitaPersona 3y ago
    I'll guess that the official app is in totally perfect shape with all their metrics. Which aren't the same metrics we measure with.
Tade0 3y ago
> The funny thing is that this is all over a stupid API that was causing more harm to Reddit than it was functioning as a public service. Better: it's about introducing pricing for said API without proper advance, so apps consuming it couldn't in turn adjust their pricing because they had plenty people on annual subscriptions. With enough forewarning the market would have adjusted to the new pricing, but that didn't happen.

telmo 3y ago

> Users were misled to believe they have power. And now are completely bewildered when they realize they don’t have as much power as they thought. First of all: if Reddit really is doing this, then it is committing an illegal act. At least in the EU, I'm sure in other jurisdictions also. There are in fact laws protecting the users. Second of all: Reddit cannot force users to post and moderate, and without those things there is no Reddit. Have you heard of Digg, by any chance? > The funny thing is that this is all over a stupid API that was causing more harm to Reddit than it was functioning as a public service. It was absolutely functioning as a public service, because third-party apps are the only ones that are actually usable. Especially so for moderator activities (that Reddit depends on to exist) and even more especially so for blind people, to whom Reddit official app does not cater. Do you know what else functions as a public service? Unpaid moderators! > The whole thing about API back in 2000s is it allows users to interface with Reddit programmably. I remember those times very well, and that was not "the whole thing" at all, there was a "bait and switch" from independent forums to centralized services based on a promise of openness forever. But I digress. Who cares what the "whole thing was about back in 2000s"? It doesn't matter what it was about, the only thing that matters is what the situation is now, and the situation is that Reddit as we know it is an interdependent partnership between a company and an extensive international community. This is what survived to 2023 and this is what matters in 2023. > Lesson: APIs are expensive to maintain and no real profitable business is going to keep them around unselfishly. Another lesson: a profitable business cannot extract value from the unpaid work of enthusiasts while at the same time expecting to be able to treat said enthusiasts as valueless replaceable cogs.

bunga-bunga 3y ago
I think your thoughts are completely off. Removing users from power is definitely not illegal. Digg lost because they changed the website, Reddit has not changed here. > third-party apps are the only ones that are actually usable In your opinion. Millions of users just use the site and official app. > valueless replaceable cogs. Which they are. Plenty of mods are ready to take care of popular subreddits. Some users will be lost, but they are the minority. The only mistake Reddit is making is by waiting too long to reign in the popular subreddits and allowing people to protest on Reddit’s own homepage.
- telmo 3y ago
  > I think your thoughts are completely off. Removing users from power is definitely not illegal. Yes, but restoring user generated content that was deleted by the creator without their consent is. That is what we are talking about here. You seem to have a crystal ball and know the future, so who am I to argue.

xaitv 3y ago

I think the current pricing of Reddit's API isn't meant to recoup costs of maintaining the API, it's meant to kill 3rd party apps so people switch to the official app, which shows ads. It's not so much the cost of maintaining the API than it is the cost of missed ad revenue.

krisoft 3y ago
> it is the cost of missed ad revenue. Then ask for that, similar to youtube red? You estimate how much each person would net you in ad revenue and ask them to contribute that much. It could be phrased as "do you like reddit? contribute to its upkeep."
justin66 3y ago
Wouldn't it have made sense for Reddit to get the official app in some kind of shape, with all the needed accessibility features and moderator controls, before killing third party apps? They just seem to be doing things out of order. Another example: alienate long-time users and mods by making it abundantly clear that they're product and free labor really should have come after the IPO.
- BonitaPersona 3y ago
  I'll guess that the official app is in totally perfect shape with all their metrics. Which aren't the same metrics we measure with.

Tade0 3y ago

> The funny thing is that this is all over a stupid API that was causing more harm to Reddit than it was functioning as a public service. Better: it's about introducing pricing for said API without proper advance, so apps consuming it couldn't in turn adjust their pricing because they had plenty people on annual subscriptions. With enough forewarning the market would have adjusted to the new pricing, but that didn't happen.