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It's especially prevalent in France (where you seem to also come from). I often jest that here engineers are just blue-collar workers with a masters degree. And

by Bayart 3y ago

It's especially prevalent in France (where you seem to also come from). I often jest that here engineers are just blue-collar workers with a masters degree. And it's not uncommon to hear engineers refer to themselves as ingésclave ("engineslave"). This being said, companies that really do provide added value and grow are usually the ones valuing their engineering staff highly. As for myself, I outright refuse to work with traditionally structured French companies.

bambax 3y ago
Yes I'm French and live and work in France, but in the UK or Germany it seems to work the same way, with extremely low wages for software developers compared to managers (except, in some cases, in the startup sphere).
- Fanmade 3y ago
  German here. Yes, it's pretty much how you described it. In my previous company they hired a new CTO. He doesn't like anyone who is smarter than him and/or who doesn't just follow orders. He quickly started hiring people who he could control, like devs from Iran who were dependent on their work visa, or just "friends" of whom he knew that they always agree with him. Less than a year after this guy started, a lot of the best people in the company have left the company. I still have several good contacts there and it is really bad. The company had good revenues and a lot of potential, but they are really struggling right now and they already had to let a lot of people go that they actually needed. There is one very good developer left who basically built most of the company's software and who is still performing like crazy because he really identifies with the company and he tries to keep it alive, even though it is literally destroying his health and family. Guess what, the CTO wants to get rid of him because he "doesn't like his attitude". He tried to force the previous Head Of Software Development to get rid of this guy until he quit himself, now he is trying to get the new Head of (one of the Iranian guys) to find a way to get rid of him. It is not easy to fire someone in Germany btw. You either need a good reason (like validated documentation that they violated the terms of their contract) or get the person to quit themselves. The Head Of knows that this guy leaving would be the worst thing to happen to this company, so he is basically just stalling. Of course the CTO gets more than triple the money of the best paid developer, plus bonuses like a car that's worth ~140k.

by Bayart 3y ago

bambax 3y ago

Yes I'm French and live and work in France, but in the UK or Germany it seems to work the same way, with extremely low wages for software developers compared to managers (except, in some cases, in the startup sphere).

Fanmade 3y ago
German here. Yes, it's pretty much how you described it. In my previous company they hired a new CTO. He doesn't like anyone who is smarter than him and/or who doesn't just follow orders. He quickly started hiring people who he could control, like devs from Iran who were dependent on their work visa, or just "friends" of whom he knew that they always agree with him. Less than a year after this guy started, a lot of the best people in the company have left the company. I still have several good contacts there and it is really bad. The company had good revenues and a lot of potential, but they are really struggling right now and they already had to let a lot of people go that they actually needed. There is one very good developer left who basically built most of the company's software and who is still performing like crazy because he really identifies with the company and he tries to keep it alive, even though it is literally destroying his health and family. Guess what, the CTO wants to get rid of him because he "doesn't like his attitude". He tried to force the previous Head Of Software Development to get rid of this guy until he quit himself, now he is trying to get the new Head of (one of the Iranian guys) to find a way to get rid of him. It is not easy to fire someone in Germany btw. You either need a good reason (like validated documentation that they violated the terms of their contract) or get the person to quit themselves. The Head Of knows that this guy leaving would be the worst thing to happen to this company, so he is basically just stalling. Of course the CTO gets more than triple the money of the best paid developer, plus bonuses like a car that's worth ~140k.