6 ms·

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but being a big fan of Starbucks who would like to be a moral/ethical person, can you explain why you are not a customer of S

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but being a big fan of Starbucks who would like to be a moral/ethical person, can you explain why you are not a customer of Starbucks or provide a link or two? Would be much appreciated thanks.

ucee054 15y ago
Starbucks's founder/CEO sends money to Israel. I don't want my coffee money to subsidize him doing that. http://www.bintjbeil.com/articles/en/020614_fisk_starbucks.html http://www.bintjbeil.com/articles/en/020614_fisk_starbucks.h... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Schultz http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Schultz
- alan_cx 15y ago
  And Marks and Spencer?
  - ucee054 15y ago
    M&S hawks Israeli produce: http://www.boycott-israel.co.uk/business-links/133-marks-and-spencer http://www.boycott-israel.co.uk/business-links/133-marks-and... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marks_%26_Spencer#cite_note-53 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marks_%26_Spencer#cite_note-53 Unfortunately I can't refer you to a comprehensive information source on companies supporting Israel, but you might find more information by googling for "jews for boycotting israeli goods" or "boycott divestment sanctions" I did find references to several other companies at http://www.inminds.com/boycott-israel-2012.php http://www.inminds.com/boycott-israel-2012.php
    - berntb 15y ago
      Sigh... I flagged the article. Please keep stories like this off HN, it is bad enough with the language wars people. (I follow the Middle East conflict a bit, because it is informative to compare my Swedish media with BBC/NY Times. News items such as Pallywood or torture between Palestinian groups are literally censored.) The basic reason I started to care a bit is because I find it depressing when people hate and demonize a whole democracy with very heterogeneous political life. Especially if said people never criticise neither rocket artillery against cities nor the glorifying of bombing/shooting children at close range. (No, it is not the Israeli side that do that.) I have also never seen any criticism from these people of the Arab world's way of destroying the Palestinian refugees' lives, by refusing to integrate them. This is arguably worse than anything Israel has done, even in your description of Israel. And to start talking about organised Jewish propaganda controlling a country's media is straight up disgusting. It smacks of the muslim world's copying of traditional anti semitic hate propaganda. Then we have the muslim world's support of the mass murders in south Sudan, which in number of dead etc must be a thousand times worse than even your description of Israel. Talk about astronomical double standards for different groups... I could continue for a while, but this won't change your opinions. You "know" that it is OK to ignore racist hate propaganda etc etc, since it is done against the evil ones.
      - joska 15y ago
        But who can be against sollar power for hatefull terrorist? Shouldn't terrorist also safe the planet?
      - Andrew_Quentin 15y ago
        How did we get from Palestine to the Muslim world? The article is about Israel and Palestine - nothing to do with the Muslim world.
        berntb 15y ago
        >>How did we get from Palestine to the Muslim world? I answered what uce0054 wrote about in the comment tree above, mainly demonizing and double standards. Edit: If you don't really think it is relevant that the main critics of Israel mistreat the Palestinians much more than Israel, it is funny... but not surprising. I've never seen that from an Israel-critic.
      - ucee054 15y ago
        You insinuated that my discussion of Hasbara means that I am some kind of "disgusting" Nazi referencing "traditional anti semitic hate propaganda", when I was linking to the Israeli Citizens Information Council's own website. You may find it "depressing when people hate", well I find it depressing when people can't answer my points and so have to resort to declaring the subject to be off limits, then smearing me, and finally changing the subject to Sudan. You owe me an apology. Oh, and by the way, the Israelis did shoot children, bomb and rocket cities in Gaza in 2009, so how on earth do you say "(No, it is not the Israeli side that do that.)"?
        berntb 15y ago
        You have nothing to say about that the Arab countries destroy Palestinians' lives more than Israel ever did? Or my other points re double standards? >>You insinuated that my discussion of Hasbara means that I am some kind of "disgusting" Nazi referencing "traditional anti semitic hate propaganda", when I was linking to the Israeli Citizens Information Council's own website. You wrote that you thought the Jews controlled the information in the US media. That is less than one step from the Zion protocols, quoted in the Hamas charter etc. That is traditional antisemitic conspiracy arguments. >>the Israelis did shoot children, bomb and rocket cities in Gaza in 2009 If an army fight people that hide among civilians, there will be civilian victims. Even if the army follows the war laws. That is very different from targeting and glorifying murdering children, which I wrote about. (And civilians are generally not a direct target for the Israeli army -- Yes, you know the Israelis are evil and want to murder children, but please realise it is bad PR and against their direct interests.)

ucee054 15y ago

Starbucks's founder/CEO sends money to Israel. I don't want my coffee money to subsidize him doing that. http://www.bintjbeil.com/articles/en/020614_fisk_starbucks.html http://www.bintjbeil.com/articles/en/020614_fisk_starbucks.h... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Schultz http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Schultz

alan_cx 15y ago
And Marks and Spencer?
- ucee054 15y ago
  M&S hawks Israeli produce: http://www.boycott-israel.co.uk/business-links/133-marks-and-spencer http://www.boycott-israel.co.uk/business-links/133-marks-and... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marks_%26_Spencer#cite_note-53 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marks_%26_Spencer#cite_note-53 Unfortunately I can't refer you to a comprehensive information source on companies supporting Israel, but you might find more information by googling for "jews for boycotting israeli goods" or "boycott divestment sanctions" I did find references to several other companies at http://www.inminds.com/boycott-israel-2012.php http://www.inminds.com/boycott-israel-2012.php
  - berntb 15y ago
    Sigh... I flagged the article. Please keep stories like this off HN, it is bad enough with the language wars people. (I follow the Middle East conflict a bit, because it is informative to compare my Swedish media with BBC/NY Times. News items such as Pallywood or torture between Palestinian groups are literally censored.) The basic reason I started to care a bit is because I find it depressing when people hate and demonize a whole democracy with very heterogeneous political life. Especially if said people never criticise neither rocket artillery against cities nor the glorifying of bombing/shooting children at close range. (No, it is not the Israeli side that do that.) I have also never seen any criticism from these people of the Arab world's way of destroying the Palestinian refugees' lives, by refusing to integrate them. This is arguably worse than anything Israel has done, even in your description of Israel. And to start talking about organised Jewish propaganda controlling a country's media is straight up disgusting. It smacks of the muslim world's copying of traditional anti semitic hate propaganda. Then we have the muslim world's support of the mass murders in south Sudan, which in number of dead etc must be a thousand times worse than even your description of Israel. Talk about astronomical double standards for different groups... I could continue for a while, but this won't change your opinions. You "know" that it is OK to ignore racist hate propaganda etc etc, since it is done against the evil ones.
    - joska 15y ago
      But who can be against sollar power for hatefull terrorist? Shouldn't terrorist also safe the planet?
    - Andrew_Quentin 15y ago
      How did we get from Palestine to the Muslim world? The article is about Israel and Palestine - nothing to do with the Muslim world.
      - berntb 15y ago
        >>How did we get from Palestine to the Muslim world? I answered what uce0054 wrote about in the comment tree above, mainly demonizing and double standards. Edit: If you don't really think it is relevant that the main critics of Israel mistreat the Palestinians much more than Israel, it is funny... but not surprising. I've never seen that from an Israel-critic.
    - ucee054 15y ago
      You insinuated that my discussion of Hasbara means that I am some kind of "disgusting" Nazi referencing "traditional anti semitic hate propaganda", when I was linking to the Israeli Citizens Information Council's own website. You may find it "depressing when people hate", well I find it depressing when people can't answer my points and so have to resort to declaring the subject to be off limits, then smearing me, and finally changing the subject to Sudan. You owe me an apology. Oh, and by the way, the Israelis did shoot children, bomb and rocket cities in Gaza in 2009, so how on earth do you say "(No, it is not the Israeli side that do that.)"?
      - berntb 15y ago
        You have nothing to say about that the Arab countries destroy Palestinians' lives more than Israel ever did? Or my other points re double standards? >>You insinuated that my discussion of Hasbara means that I am some kind of "disgusting" Nazi referencing "traditional anti semitic hate propaganda", when I was linking to the Israeli Citizens Information Council's own website. You wrote that you thought the Jews controlled the information in the US media. That is less than one step from the Zion protocols, quoted in the Hamas charter etc. That is traditional antisemitic conspiracy arguments. >>the Israelis did shoot children, bomb and rocket cities in Gaza in 2009 If an army fight people that hide among civilians, there will be civilian victims. Even if the army follows the war laws. That is very different from targeting and glorifying murdering children, which I wrote about. (And civilians are generally not a direct target for the Israeli army -- Yes, you know the Israelis are evil and want to murder children, but please realise it is bad PR and against their direct interests.)