3 ms·

Maybe before you actually start writing code its nice to create some domain diagrams which you can convert to class diagrams. Saves a ton of time. And you have

Maybe before you actually start writing code its nice to create some domain diagrams which you can convert to class diagrams. Saves a ton of time. And you have good discussions about the general high level workings of an architecture. Can be done on a whiteboard. Make some pics and start coding.

radicalbyte 3y ago
Assuming that you're using a modern IDE: it is an order of magnitude quicker to model the domain (classes + attributes) in code and project them as diagrams, say with graphvis. High level boxes are great for thinking about systems but the key there is abstraction - minimal viable level of detail..
- holoduke 3y ago
  Dont you want to discuss and talk about a design before you even touch a keyboard? In my projects we always discus high level overviews with pen and whiteboards. Nobody should even dare to touch a keyboard.
  - radicalbyte 3y ago
    Absolutely, I pretty much always start with design sessions on a whiteboard (or if remote a call using draw.io). That discussion is almost never going down the the level of an individual class and NEVER adheres to the UML standard. Very occasionally I've had discussions about class structure by drawing class name + methods on a whiteboard but having the same discussion using Visual Studio's UML projection was just as effective.
- TuringTest 3y ago
  If you're creating diagrams with graphvis, you're just coding on another language. The benefits of diagrams appear when you draw them by hand (or graphically by mouse).
  - radicalbyte 3y ago
    I generate them: initially with my own generator (which is copyright an employer from > 15 years ago), on a later project I found that Doxygen can do do that for you out of the box :-) For interactive discussion I just use Visual Studio's projection, for databases I use the SQL Server Management Tool ERD projector or pgAdmin if I'm using Postgres.
    - TuringTest 3y ago
      The point is that you're generating diagrams from code that's already been written, you're not modelling, do you? ;-) Those are a different kind of diagram than the one you create from scratch to decide what goes in the program.
- jxramos 3y ago
  this phrase caught my eye, "minimally viable level of detail", to which I immediately thought "minimal detail for a coherent thought". That's a cool concept actually I might hold on to and develop.

radicalbyte 3y ago

Assuming that you're using a modern IDE: it is an order of magnitude quicker to model the domain (classes + attributes) in code and project them as diagrams, say with graphvis. High level boxes are great for thinking about systems but the key there is abstraction - minimal viable level of detail..

holoduke 3y ago
Dont you want to discuss and talk about a design before you even touch a keyboard? In my projects we always discus high level overviews with pen and whiteboards. Nobody should even dare to touch a keyboard.
- radicalbyte 3y ago
  Absolutely, I pretty much always start with design sessions on a whiteboard (or if remote a call using draw.io). That discussion is almost never going down the the level of an individual class and NEVER adheres to the UML standard. Very occasionally I've had discussions about class structure by drawing class name + methods on a whiteboard but having the same discussion using Visual Studio's UML projection was just as effective.
TuringTest 3y ago
If you're creating diagrams with graphvis, you're just coding on another language. The benefits of diagrams appear when you draw them by hand (or graphically by mouse).
- radicalbyte 3y ago
  I generate them: initially with my own generator (which is copyright an employer from > 15 years ago), on a later project I found that Doxygen can do do that for you out of the box :-) For interactive discussion I just use Visual Studio's projection, for databases I use the SQL Server Management Tool ERD projector or pgAdmin if I'm using Postgres.
  - TuringTest 3y ago
    The point is that you're generating diagrams from code that's already been written, you're not modelling, do you? ;-) Those are a different kind of diagram than the one you create from scratch to decide what goes in the program.
jxramos 3y ago
this phrase caught my eye, "minimally viable level of detail", to which I immediately thought "minimal detail for a coherent thought". That's a cool concept actually I might hold on to and develop.