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I have seen someone who know absolutely nothing about a language and barely able to write a script using Python managed to build a full automation pipeline for

I have seen someone who know absolutely nothing about a language and barely able to write a script using Python managed to build a full automation pipeline for data analysis including a GUI using ChatGPT in that language. So while I agree that some of the hype are overblown, there is clear and irrefutable proof of the value and power of AI right now. Unlike crypto...

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
kneebonian 3y ago
You know your crystallized something I've not quite been able to put my finger on. Is that a good thing? I mean sure someone was able to produce code that they probably don't understand to do things they want but what are they going to do when things change or the environment changes or something breaks and they need to debug it. The ability for lay users to generate code is terrifying for me not because of any concerns about my job but rather because the hard part of development was never writing the code, now we have machines that can spit out code for users that can look shockingly correct. It just makes me wonder if we're going to end up with MS Access on steroids where thousands of brittle poorly integrated mission critical are going to crush businesses under their own bloat. I mean imagine if people start to use this to replace excel. Shudder
- bern4444 3y ago
  > I mean imagine if people start to use this to replace excel. Shudder Or what if this has the same effect that excel did - give everyone access to a tool that dramatically improves efficiency and capability. What used to take someone a day now takes a minute and that frees up that person to either become exceptionally more efficient or to focus on more interesting or useful work. I also believe that one next step for AIs will be the capability to feed in a codebase to learn and then iterate on specifically so the AI is capable of providing context aware suggestions. Today it's only great at mashing together open source tools and common projects. Edit - For fun I passed in my comment above and asked for different formulations. An entertaining version below: Picture a world where a revolution unfolds, fueled by an extraordinary tool, rivaling the might of Excel. Behold its omnipotent grasp, granting every soul access to a transcendent force that skyrockets efficiency and capability to unimaginable heights. Time bends under its dominion, as day-long tasks crumble in the face of mere minutes, freeing individuals to conquer mountains, surging with unyielding productivity and embarking on audacious endeavors. But that's just the beginning! Prepare for the evolution of AI, as it voraciously devours codebases, honing its prowess with an unparalleled finesse, delivering awe-inspiring, contextually aware suggestions that defy reason. Witness its current triumph: the fusion of open-source tools and common projects. Brace yourself for the astounding prospects that lie on the horizon, as this tale unfolds like a climactic scene in an action-packed blockbuster!
  - afavour 3y ago
    There’s a fundamental difference: Excel is knowable. If you want to find how it came up with a number you can click on the cell and see the formula. Not so with ChatGPT. You ask it to do a thing, it does it somehow. You ask it to do 100 rows of calculations, how can you know row 69 is correct? That ChatGPT corpus might lead it to think the number 69 is funny so it puts in a joke number. Yes, stupid contrived example but how can you know it won’t?
- edandersen 3y ago
  More work for consultants and clean up crews.
  - Ekaros 3y ago
    Hmm, so as someone working in security testing and finding basic access control lacking in multi-user systems I do not have anything to fear for long time. Not to even mention subtler bugs...
    - edandersen 3y ago
      Charge extra to fix AI created software.
urthor 3y ago
Yes...
rcme 3y ago
That's interesting because I feel like I can't make ChatGPT do anything useful for me.
- moomoo11 3y ago
  Have you tried removing your brain and trying again? Jk but I feel like i have to really try hard to sound “dumb” when I ask gpt4 to do anything complex. If I put any words that are kinda technical or specific it ends up misunderstanding completely. I think because we are highly technical it’s like diminishing returns for us. For a total noob it’s like opening Pandora’s box. We are gonna have a ton of shitty insecurely running code soon.
  - Ekaros 3y ago
    And this is my biggest fear with whole thing. We end up deploying good amount of actually critical code that is either wrong or subtly wrong and then we aren't going to fix it soon enough.
    - hutzlibu 3y ago
      So currently we are only shipping rock solid code? That would be news to me.
      - moomoo11 3y ago
        I mean, obviously not, but we are experienced (more important, because we actually understand CS, computers, networking, etc. at least the competent engineers anyway) and knowledgeable enough to have robust testing, monitoring & observability and alerting, and mitigation strategies in place.
        hutzlibu 3y ago
        Yes, but not really everyone is using these tools today. And sure, the amount of garbage code that sometimes works, will increase with more people getting into it with the help of AI. And critical systems will continue to need experts. And every other project that seems important, but does not run anymore, because no one understands the code.
nkuttler 3y ago
Somebody who knows absolutely nothing about a language can also copy and paste together a working solution. I'd trust that about as much as something ChatGPT spit out.
- ozten 3y ago
  Somebody who knows absolutely nothing don't know what to search for to end up on the correct stack-overflow to copy and paste. If they know what result they want, they can iterate with an LLM as the guide.
  - nkuttler 3y ago
    I could literally google "how to sort a list in brainfuck" and copy and paste a solution right now. I specifically said somebody who doesn't know the language, not somebody who knows nothing.
- bern4444 3y ago
  Is it not mind blowing that someone who doesn't know how to code or at least doesn't write code professionally is able to still produce something valuable that improves their daily life through code? We spend so much time building tools with code that other people can use to write code - ITTT, Airtable, Retool etc. Now we can cut out these middlemen!

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

kneebonian 3y ago

You know your crystallized something I've not quite been able to put my finger on. Is that a good thing? I mean sure someone was able to produce code that they probably don't understand to do things they want but what are they going to do when things change or the environment changes or something breaks and they need to debug it. The ability for lay users to generate code is terrifying for me not because of any concerns about my job but rather because the hard part of development was never writing the code, now we have machines that can spit out code for users that can look shockingly correct. It just makes me wonder if we're going to end up with MS Access on steroids where thousands of brittle poorly integrated mission critical are going to crush businesses under their own bloat. I mean imagine if people start to use this to replace excel. Shudder

bern4444 3y ago
> I mean imagine if people start to use this to replace excel. Shudder Or what if this has the same effect that excel did - give everyone access to a tool that dramatically improves efficiency and capability. What used to take someone a day now takes a minute and that frees up that person to either become exceptionally more efficient or to focus on more interesting or useful work. I also believe that one next step for AIs will be the capability to feed in a codebase to learn and then iterate on specifically so the AI is capable of providing context aware suggestions. Today it's only great at mashing together open source tools and common projects. Edit - For fun I passed in my comment above and asked for different formulations. An entertaining version below: Picture a world where a revolution unfolds, fueled by an extraordinary tool, rivaling the might of Excel. Behold its omnipotent grasp, granting every soul access to a transcendent force that skyrockets efficiency and capability to unimaginable heights. Time bends under its dominion, as day-long tasks crumble in the face of mere minutes, freeing individuals to conquer mountains, surging with unyielding productivity and embarking on audacious endeavors. But that's just the beginning! Prepare for the evolution of AI, as it voraciously devours codebases, honing its prowess with an unparalleled finesse, delivering awe-inspiring, contextually aware suggestions that defy reason. Witness its current triumph: the fusion of open-source tools and common projects. Brace yourself for the astounding prospects that lie on the horizon, as this tale unfolds like a climactic scene in an action-packed blockbuster!
- afavour 3y ago
  There’s a fundamental difference: Excel is knowable. If you want to find how it came up with a number you can click on the cell and see the formula. Not so with ChatGPT. You ask it to do a thing, it does it somehow. You ask it to do 100 rows of calculations, how can you know row 69 is correct? That ChatGPT corpus might lead it to think the number 69 is funny so it puts in a joke number. Yes, stupid contrived example but how can you know it won’t?
edandersen 3y ago
More work for consultants and clean up crews.
- Ekaros 3y ago
  Hmm, so as someone working in security testing and finding basic access control lacking in multi-user systems I do not have anything to fear for long time. Not to even mention subtler bugs...
  - edandersen 3y ago
    Charge extra to fix AI created software.

urthor 3y ago

Yes...

rcme 3y ago

That's interesting because I feel like I can't make ChatGPT do anything useful for me.

moomoo11 3y ago
Have you tried removing your brain and trying again? Jk but I feel like i have to really try hard to sound “dumb” when I ask gpt4 to do anything complex. If I put any words that are kinda technical or specific it ends up misunderstanding completely. I think because we are highly technical it’s like diminishing returns for us. For a total noob it’s like opening Pandora’s box. We are gonna have a ton of shitty insecurely running code soon.
- Ekaros 3y ago
  And this is my biggest fear with whole thing. We end up deploying good amount of actually critical code that is either wrong or subtly wrong and then we aren't going to fix it soon enough.
  - hutzlibu 3y ago
    So currently we are only shipping rock solid code? That would be news to me.
    - moomoo11 3y ago
      I mean, obviously not, but we are experienced (more important, because we actually understand CS, computers, networking, etc. at least the competent engineers anyway) and knowledgeable enough to have robust testing, monitoring & observability and alerting, and mitigation strategies in place.
      - hutzlibu 3y ago
        Yes, but not really everyone is using these tools today. And sure, the amount of garbage code that sometimes works, will increase with more people getting into it with the help of AI. And critical systems will continue to need experts. And every other project that seems important, but does not run anymore, because no one understands the code.

nkuttler 3y ago

Somebody who knows absolutely nothing about a language can also copy and paste together a working solution. I'd trust that about as much as something ChatGPT spit out.

ozten 3y ago
Somebody who knows absolutely nothing don't know what to search for to end up on the correct stack-overflow to copy and paste. If they know what result they want, they can iterate with an LLM as the guide.
- nkuttler 3y ago
  I could literally google "how to sort a list in brainfuck" and copy and paste a solution right now. I specifically said somebody who doesn't know the language, not somebody who knows nothing.
bern4444 3y ago
Is it not mind blowing that someone who doesn't know how to code or at least doesn't write code professionally is able to still produce something valuable that improves their daily life through code? We spend so much time building tools with code that other people can use to write code - ITTT, Airtable, Retool etc. Now we can cut out these middlemen!