8 ms·

It's a very good book that I will never read again.

jfengel 3y ago
It was, I'm told, a very good book that I noped out of about ten pages in. I made it that far before becoming incredibly annoyed at the way literature critics were praising his new invention of post-apocalyptic stories which nobody had ever read before ever. Also, if I remember correctly, he felt that the rules of punctuation didn't apply to him. Maybe that paid off if I'd read more than ten pages. I don't doubt that he was a true giant. But even setting aside these purely meta-textual gripes, it's just not a story I want to hear. If I want to be depressed and angry, I'll read Hacker News.
- tehnub 3y ago
  I haven't read it myself, but I've seen many report that it was uplifting to them. Amid the utter horror and hopeless bleakness a parent does everything they can to protect their child.
  - oilchange 3y ago
    > I haven't read it myself, but I've seen many report that it was uplifting to them. Uplifting? There was nothing uplifting about The Road. It's a world without hope. From the description of the forests, seas, societies and families, cormac builds a truly hopeless apocalypse with no hope for redemption or salvation. A world where hope cannot exist. > Amid the utter horror and hopeless bleakness a parent does everything they can to protect their child. A father tries to do everything he can to save his son, but ultimately, he fails. It's a world without hope after all. The father dies and a bunch of cannibals "take in" the boy. It's one of the rare books that I finished in one sitting and then read again a few days later.
    - tehnub 3y ago
      But the love between the father and his son persists to the very end. Here are some people using the word uplift in their review on Amazon: [0]. There are some negations though ("this book is not uplifting"). [0]: https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McCarthy-ebook/product-reviews/B000OI0G1Q/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_viewopt_kywd?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&pageNumber=1&filterByKeyword=uplifting https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McC...
      - oilchange 3y ago
        > But the love between the father and his son persists to the very end. So what? Of course the love between a father and son persists. It's only natural. But that's not the point of the book. The book is about finding hope. The father is desperately trying to save his son. To find hope for his son. He thinks there is hope along the coast. That's why they are on "the road". When they reach the coast, they find a leaden sea holding no life. All marine life is dead. They find no hope. There, cannibals that were hunting the father and son shoot the father with an arrow and the father dies. The son buries his father and the cannibals find the boy and "take him in". > [0]: https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McC https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McC... This is just reviews with the word "uplifting". Many of the comments with "uplifting" is just saying it is not uplifting. "This is an unusual book. There is nothing uplifting here, so don't expect it." "As uplifting as a charred word void of virtually all-living species. As uplifting as a dead land shrouded in night, blanketed with ash and gray snow, legions of charcoaled corpses ornamenting the highways and hallways. As uplifting as the vicious gangs who prowl the countryside surviving on the last food source - other humans. As uplifting as the Halocaust, Idi Amin's Uganda, or Pol Pot's Cambodia." Read the book. There is nothing uplifting about it. The only thing uplifting about it is that we don't live in such a world. It's as hopeless a world as you can possibly create. It's a world where the wife and mother of the protagonists goes off into the woods to kill herself rather than face the horrors that await her and her husband and her son. That's how bleak and hopeless the world is. It's a world where the father carries a gun to take out his son and himself in case the cannibals get them. It's a world where the father fails to keep his promise to his son and dies, leaving him to a pack of cannibals. And that isn't even the worst of it. What exactly is uplifting here?
    - huthuthike 3y ago
      I disagree with your interpretation of the ending. It felt to me that the family that takes in the boy are not bad people.
      - oilchange 3y ago
        > It felt to me that the family that takes in the boy are not bad people. What family? You really believe the man and woman who took in the boy had a "family"? A world where boy's own mother abandoned him and his father to kill herself because there was no hope. A world where there are no plants, animals, fish, etc left. A world where a a woman gives birth and then she and her friends cook the fetus over a campfire. You think in a world where there is no food, no possibility of food, where everyone is either starving to death or cannibalizing, that there is a happy family? It's a world where everyone is starving to death. You think "a family" is going to take in an extra mouth to feed? Did you miss the parts in the book where they explicitly mention how there is no children the boy's age left? The boy desperately wants a friend but there are no children his age left. Except for that one "imaginary" kid he ran into that disappeared. Why do you think that is? Also, the father and son were being hunted by a pack of cannibals who mortally wound the father. What are the odds that the cannibal hunters caught up to him. What are the odds that a magical good samaritan family stumbled upon him? When I first read the book, I thought the kid was saved. Then I reread it and boy cormac really made it crystal clear how hopeless that world was.
        huthuthike 3y ago
        The boy offers to give the man his pistol but the man tells him to keep it. That indicates the man is not trying to trick him. Talking about odds in a fictional story is misguided. The odds are 100% whatever the writer intended.
        oilchange 3y ago
        > The boy offers to give the man his pistol but the man tells him to keep it. That indicates the man is not trying to trick him. Yes and the nice cannibal they killed offered to give them food and shelter. Remember how nice that cannibal was? The pistol was worthless and if I remember correctly, it didn't even have a bullet left. Of course he let him keep it. It's no threat. > Talking about odds in a fictional story is misguided. No. It's a matter of determining what is most likely. > The odds are 100% whatever the writer intended. Yes. The author wrote everything that led up to the meeting for a reason. Everything the author wrote leads to the man and woman being cannibals. It's pretty obvious. It isn't a children's book. For children, the author explains everything clearly and spoonfeeds you. But for adult books you have to think about what the author is trying to say. Did that world seem like it had any good samaritans that you envision. No it did not. For a reason. What the author intended is 100% obvious. You don't like it because you childishly want a happy ending. Cormac wasn't writing disney books or children books. If you are still confused and you seem to be, go read his other books. You'll understand what kind of writer he was.
- lelandfe 3y ago
  There are many well-respected authors who flout typical grammar. Robert Caro writes sentences as long as whole pages.
- karaterobot 3y ago
  Don't blame him for being praised by critics, I don't believe he's the one who claimed to have invented post-apocalyptic fiction. I get the punctuation issue, but I think his writing is proof that you don't always need to follow the rules from elementary school. He was so meticulous that, even without commas, all his sentences remained clear, and the effect it had was—for most readers anyway—to make the meaning somehow clearer, and certainly more powerful.
  - jfengel 3y ago
    Honestly, I should have led with the last thing. The real reason I didn't want to read it is that it was violent and unpleasant. There are many people who find value in such things. I'm not among them.
- oilchange 3y ago
  > It was, I'm told, a very good book that I noped out of about ten pages in. That's strange. The book grabs your attention from the get go. It starts strong. Stays strong. Ends strong. > I made it that far before becoming incredibly annoyed at the way literature critics were praising his new invention of post-apocalyptic stories which nobody had ever read before ever. This makes absolutely no sense. Were you reading the book and reading reviews at the same time? > Also, if I remember correctly, he felt that the rules of punctuation didn't apply to him. Maybe that paid off if I'd read more than ten pages. His punctuation was fine. The book reads well. His words and sentences flow. I found it easily one of the most accessible. > it's just not a story I want to hear. If I want to be depressed and angry Hacker News. Ah there it is. People with petty gripes always have an agenda. So your "gripes" above are just because you want don't like apocalytic stories and want to warn people off it? Why not just say so instead of making up silly criticisms? Also, it's a work of fiction. It isn't real. Really nothing to get depressed or angry about. If anything, it should make you happy since we don't like in such a hopeless world. But really, like all great literature, it should make you think.
  - nl 3y ago
    > His punctuation was fine. The book reads well. His words and sentences flow. I found it easily one of the most accessible. No, this is a fair criticism. It's true this is done for literary effect, but it does make it harder to read. To quote McCarthy himself: > James Joyce is a good model for punctuation. He keeps it to an absolute minimum. There’s no reason to blot the page up with weird little marks. I mean, if you write properly you shouldn’t have to punctuate.[1] Whilst this might be true, his punctuation style is non-conventional and that does break our expectations making it harder to follow. [1] https://www.openculture.com/2013/08/cormac-mccarthys-punctuation-rules.html https://www.openculture.com/2013/08/cormac-mccarthys-punctua...
    - oilchange 3y ago
      > It's true this is done for literary effect, but it does make it harder to read. What literary effect? I didn't even notice there were punctuation issues until I read the guy's comment. Maybe since it was basically a book where most of the dialogue is between two people? It was one of the easiest and most straightforward reads of my life. > > James Joyce is a good model for punctuation. He keeps it to an absolute minimum. There’s no reason to blot the page up with weird little marks. I mean, if you write properly you shouldn’t have to punctuate.[1] ...“to make it easier, not to make it harder” to decipher his prose. He wrote that way to make it easier to read. And I agree with him. His prose just flowed. Also, the problem with joyce isn't the punctation. Even with proper punctuation, joyce would be difficult. But if people have issues with it, then so be it. Are there any examples where his punctuation caused issues for readers?
- danjoredd 3y ago
  >I don't doubt that he was a true giant. But even setting aside these purely meta-textual gripes, it's just not a story I want to hear. If I want to be depressed and angry, I'll read Hacker News. I completely understand. For me, I see it as a story about clinging to hope despite impossible odds. The theming reminds me of the manga Berserk, but way more grounded in reality and somehow even more depressing. Spoilers: The main character is dying, and will leave his son to fend for himself when he does. The son doesn't really stand a chance, but it is his responsibility to teach him to "carry the fire." It ends a bit vague...the father dies and the kid refuses to leave the body. Eventually a man comes by and offers to take care of him. Whether or not he is actually a good guy, or yet another disgusting person, is not really known. But its a glimmer of hope, and that is what is important to the message. As long as there is hope, carry the fire. This article by Art of Manliness is what convinced me to read it despite how depressing it is. The book isn't for everyone, but it IS life changing in my opinion: https://www.artofmanliness.com/people/fatherhood/carry-the-fire/ https://www.artofmanliness.com/people/fatherhood/carry-the-f...
- brodouevencode 3y ago
  > the rules of punctuation didn't apply to him don't ever, ever read Riddley Walker
tnorthcutt 3y ago
Same here, I think. I read it before I had a son; I'm not sure I could manage to finish it now that I do.
- B2B_human 3y ago
  I actually just got the book last week after hearing an interview on the radio and the mentioned “the road” and I realized I’d read it in high school. Now I have a daughter and am also wondering how different it may seem on this reading of the book…
  - doubled112 3y ago
    All I remember about The Road is that I didn't enjoy it in high school at all. An incredibly bleak walk, is really all I remember. Maybe I'd appreciate it more now.
- elevaet 3y ago
  Same here but with the movie. I think I want to read the book but not sure if its just too crushing to read as a dad.
iaresee 3y ago
This is exactly how I feel about it. Once was enough. Once and forever haunted.
JasserInicide 3y ago
Yup, pretty much. There was this one passage about the man and the boy hiding and watching some guy. Can't quite remember what was going on, he was like struggling or something, gravely wounded, and then he just dropped dead. The way it read...I felt completely empty and dejected after it and put the book down for a couple days.

It was, I'm told, a very good book that I noped out of about ten pages in. I made it that far before becoming incredibly annoyed at the way literature critics were praising his new invention of post-apocalyptic stories which nobody had ever read before ever. Also, if I remember correctly, he felt that the rules of punctuation didn't apply to him. Maybe that paid off if I'd read more than ten pages. I don't doubt that he was a true giant. But even setting aside these purely meta-textual gripes, it's just not a story I want to hear. If I want to be depressed and angry, I'll read Hacker News.

tehnub 3y ago
I haven't read it myself, but I've seen many report that it was uplifting to them. Amid the utter horror and hopeless bleakness a parent does everything they can to protect their child.
- oilchange 3y ago
  > I haven't read it myself, but I've seen many report that it was uplifting to them. Uplifting? There was nothing uplifting about The Road. It's a world without hope. From the description of the forests, seas, societies and families, cormac builds a truly hopeless apocalypse with no hope for redemption or salvation. A world where hope cannot exist. > Amid the utter horror and hopeless bleakness a parent does everything they can to protect their child. A father tries to do everything he can to save his son, but ultimately, he fails. It's a world without hope after all. The father dies and a bunch of cannibals "take in" the boy. It's one of the rare books that I finished in one sitting and then read again a few days later.
  - tehnub 3y ago
    But the love between the father and his son persists to the very end. Here are some people using the word uplift in their review on Amazon: [0]. There are some negations though ("this book is not uplifting"). [0]: https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McCarthy-ebook/product-reviews/B000OI0G1Q/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_viewopt_kywd?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&pageNumber=1&filterByKeyword=uplifting https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McC...
    - oilchange 3y ago
      > But the love between the father and his son persists to the very end. So what? Of course the love between a father and son persists. It's only natural. But that's not the point of the book. The book is about finding hope. The father is desperately trying to save his son. To find hope for his son. He thinks there is hope along the coast. That's why they are on "the road". When they reach the coast, they find a leaden sea holding no life. All marine life is dead. They find no hope. There, cannibals that were hunting the father and son shoot the father with an arrow and the father dies. The son buries his father and the cannibals find the boy and "take him in". > [0]: https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McC https://www.amazon.com/Road-Vintage-International-Cormac-McC... This is just reviews with the word "uplifting". Many of the comments with "uplifting" is just saying it is not uplifting. "This is an unusual book. There is nothing uplifting here, so don't expect it." "As uplifting as a charred word void of virtually all-living species. As uplifting as a dead land shrouded in night, blanketed with ash and gray snow, legions of charcoaled corpses ornamenting the highways and hallways. As uplifting as the vicious gangs who prowl the countryside surviving on the last food source - other humans. As uplifting as the Halocaust, Idi Amin's Uganda, or Pol Pot's Cambodia." Read the book. There is nothing uplifting about it. The only thing uplifting about it is that we don't live in such a world. It's as hopeless a world as you can possibly create. It's a world where the wife and mother of the protagonists goes off into the woods to kill herself rather than face the horrors that await her and her husband and her son. That's how bleak and hopeless the world is. It's a world where the father carries a gun to take out his son and himself in case the cannibals get them. It's a world where the father fails to keep his promise to his son and dies, leaving him to a pack of cannibals. And that isn't even the worst of it. What exactly is uplifting here?
  - huthuthike 3y ago
    I disagree with your interpretation of the ending. It felt to me that the family that takes in the boy are not bad people.
    - oilchange 3y ago
      > It felt to me that the family that takes in the boy are not bad people. What family? You really believe the man and woman who took in the boy had a "family"? A world where boy's own mother abandoned him and his father to kill herself because there was no hope. A world where there are no plants, animals, fish, etc left. A world where a a woman gives birth and then she and her friends cook the fetus over a campfire. You think in a world where there is no food, no possibility of food, where everyone is either starving to death or cannibalizing, that there is a happy family? It's a world where everyone is starving to death. You think "a family" is going to take in an extra mouth to feed? Did you miss the parts in the book where they explicitly mention how there is no children the boy's age left? The boy desperately wants a friend but there are no children his age left. Except for that one "imaginary" kid he ran into that disappeared. Why do you think that is? Also, the father and son were being hunted by a pack of cannibals who mortally wound the father. What are the odds that the cannibal hunters caught up to him. What are the odds that a magical good samaritan family stumbled upon him? When I first read the book, I thought the kid was saved. Then I reread it and boy cormac really made it crystal clear how hopeless that world was.
      - huthuthike 3y ago
        The boy offers to give the man his pistol but the man tells him to keep it. That indicates the man is not trying to trick him. Talking about odds in a fictional story is misguided. The odds are 100% whatever the writer intended.
        oilchange 3y ago
        > The boy offers to give the man his pistol but the man tells him to keep it. That indicates the man is not trying to trick him. Yes and the nice cannibal they killed offered to give them food and shelter. Remember how nice that cannibal was? The pistol was worthless and if I remember correctly, it didn't even have a bullet left. Of course he let him keep it. It's no threat. > Talking about odds in a fictional story is misguided. No. It's a matter of determining what is most likely. > The odds are 100% whatever the writer intended. Yes. The author wrote everything that led up to the meeting for a reason. Everything the author wrote leads to the man and woman being cannibals. It's pretty obvious. It isn't a children's book. For children, the author explains everything clearly and spoonfeeds you. But for adult books you have to think about what the author is trying to say. Did that world seem like it had any good samaritans that you envision. No it did not. For a reason. What the author intended is 100% obvious. You don't like it because you childishly want a happy ending. Cormac wasn't writing disney books or children books. If you are still confused and you seem to be, go read his other books. You'll understand what kind of writer he was.
lelandfe 3y ago
There are many well-respected authors who flout typical grammar. Robert Caro writes sentences as long as whole pages.
karaterobot 3y ago
Don't blame him for being praised by critics, I don't believe he's the one who claimed to have invented post-apocalyptic fiction. I get the punctuation issue, but I think his writing is proof that you don't always need to follow the rules from elementary school. He was so meticulous that, even without commas, all his sentences remained clear, and the effect it had was—for most readers anyway—to make the meaning somehow clearer, and certainly more powerful.
- jfengel 3y ago
  Honestly, I should have led with the last thing. The real reason I didn't want to read it is that it was violent and unpleasant. There are many people who find value in such things. I'm not among them.
oilchange 3y ago
> It was, I'm told, a very good book that I noped out of about ten pages in. That's strange. The book grabs your attention from the get go. It starts strong. Stays strong. Ends strong. > I made it that far before becoming incredibly annoyed at the way literature critics were praising his new invention of post-apocalyptic stories which nobody had ever read before ever. This makes absolutely no sense. Were you reading the book and reading reviews at the same time? > Also, if I remember correctly, he felt that the rules of punctuation didn't apply to him. Maybe that paid off if I'd read more than ten pages. His punctuation was fine. The book reads well. His words and sentences flow. I found it easily one of the most accessible. > it's just not a story I want to hear. If I want to be depressed and angry Hacker News. Ah there it is. People with petty gripes always have an agenda. So your "gripes" above are just because you want don't like apocalytic stories and want to warn people off it? Why not just say so instead of making up silly criticisms? Also, it's a work of fiction. It isn't real. Really nothing to get depressed or angry about. If anything, it should make you happy since we don't like in such a hopeless world. But really, like all great literature, it should make you think.
- nl 3y ago
  > His punctuation was fine. The book reads well. His words and sentences flow. I found it easily one of the most accessible. No, this is a fair criticism. It's true this is done for literary effect, but it does make it harder to read. To quote McCarthy himself: > James Joyce is a good model for punctuation. He keeps it to an absolute minimum. There’s no reason to blot the page up with weird little marks. I mean, if you write properly you shouldn’t have to punctuate.[1] Whilst this might be true, his punctuation style is non-conventional and that does break our expectations making it harder to follow. [1] https://www.openculture.com/2013/08/cormac-mccarthys-punctuation-rules.html https://www.openculture.com/2013/08/cormac-mccarthys-punctua...
  - oilchange 3y ago
    > It's true this is done for literary effect, but it does make it harder to read. What literary effect? I didn't even notice there were punctuation issues until I read the guy's comment. Maybe since it was basically a book where most of the dialogue is between two people? It was one of the easiest and most straightforward reads of my life. > > James Joyce is a good model for punctuation. He keeps it to an absolute minimum. There’s no reason to blot the page up with weird little marks. I mean, if you write properly you shouldn’t have to punctuate.[1] ...“to make it easier, not to make it harder” to decipher his prose. He wrote that way to make it easier to read. And I agree with him. His prose just flowed. Also, the problem with joyce isn't the punctation. Even with proper punctuation, joyce would be difficult. But if people have issues with it, then so be it. Are there any examples where his punctuation caused issues for readers?
danjoredd 3y ago
>I don't doubt that he was a true giant. But even setting aside these purely meta-textual gripes, it's just not a story I want to hear. If I want to be depressed and angry, I'll read Hacker News. I completely understand. For me, I see it as a story about clinging to hope despite impossible odds. The theming reminds me of the manga Berserk, but way more grounded in reality and somehow even more depressing. Spoilers: The main character is dying, and will leave his son to fend for himself when he does. The son doesn't really stand a chance, but it is his responsibility to teach him to "carry the fire." It ends a bit vague...the father dies and the kid refuses to leave the body. Eventually a man comes by and offers to take care of him. Whether or not he is actually a good guy, or yet another disgusting person, is not really known. But its a glimmer of hope, and that is what is important to the message. As long as there is hope, carry the fire. This article by Art of Manliness is what convinced me to read it despite how depressing it is. The book isn't for everyone, but it IS life changing in my opinion: https://www.artofmanliness.com/people/fatherhood/carry-the-fire/ https://www.artofmanliness.com/people/fatherhood/carry-the-f...
brodouevencode 3y ago
> the rules of punctuation didn't apply to him don't ever, ever read Riddley Walker

tnorthcutt 3y ago

Same here, I think. I read it before I had a son; I'm not sure I could manage to finish it now that I do.

B2B_human 3y ago
I actually just got the book last week after hearing an interview on the radio and the mentioned “the road” and I realized I’d read it in high school. Now I have a daughter and am also wondering how different it may seem on this reading of the book…
- doubled112 3y ago
  All I remember about The Road is that I didn't enjoy it in high school at all. An incredibly bleak walk, is really all I remember. Maybe I'd appreciate it more now.
elevaet 3y ago
Same here but with the movie. I think I want to read the book but not sure if its just too crushing to read as a dad.

iaresee 3y ago

This is exactly how I feel about it. Once was enough. Once and forever haunted.

JasserInicide 3y ago

Yup, pretty much. There was this one passage about the man and the boy hiding and watching some guy. Can't quite remember what was going on, he was like struggling or something, gravely wounded, and then he just dropped dead. The way it read...I felt completely empty and dejected after it and put the book down for a couple days.