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It's clear he is blackmailing them and the upset users are his leverage. After posting that "Apollo will close down on June 30th." he now says "Same as always:

by kats 3y ago

It's clear he is blackmailing them and the upset users are his leverage. After posting that "Apollo will close down on June 30th." he now says "Same as always: I love building Apollo, and if Reddit is willing to to talk I'm happy to as well." which of course was not what he always said. He was never joking about asking for 10 million dollars and is still hoping for an offer.

ekanes 3y ago
> Same as always: I love building Apollo, and if Reddit is willing to to talk I'm happy to as well. Got a source for that? He's made it clear that it's too late, and this can't be repaired. How can you trust someone that lied to make you look bad, and you have proof?
- joshstrange 3y ago
  There is no source, it's a combination of a number of things Christian said in the article, a paraphrasing at best, a strawman more likely. From the article it's clear to me that Christian would come back to the table if Reddit lowered the price and/or gave app developers more time but as it stands now they haven't even replied to him in week(s). Hard to do any negotiating when the other side refuses to talk /and/ slanders/lies about you in public.
  - ekanes 3y ago
    Hey, sorry. You were right. I didn't read TFA and just jumped into the comments with outdated opinions. I'm a bit surprised that he'd go back to them, honestly. Would much rather he turn his talents and Appolo towards making the Fediverse easier to use.
  - kats 3y ago
    Yes there is a source. It's quote from his most recent comment on reddit. https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/147a8xb/as_the_subreddit_blackout_begins_i_wanted_to_say/jnxhov1/?context=3 https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/147a8xb/as_the_s...
leokennis 3y ago
It seems you don’t really see the power dynamics here. Reddit holds all the power: they have the API, they can shut anyone out of it, they can ask for it whatever they want, they could even re-open all closed subreddits and install new mods. All the community and Apollo has is the power to say “Reddit, if you don’t play nice, we’ll walk away”. To call that a blackmail requires some mental gymnastics.
- kats 3y ago
  Nope, Reddit currently has a bunch of their subreddits private. And if the Apollo dev gets paid, then he can come up with something to make the blackout go away. That's the leverage he has to ask for money. It's what he implied in the call he had recorded, and he keeps indicating he's open to an offer. If reddit goes back to normal before he has an offer then that's when he has no leverage anymore.
  - Timon3 3y ago
    > Nope, Reddit currently has a bunch of their subreddits private. And if the Apollo dev gets paid, then he can come up with something to make the blackout go away. Can you explain what that could be? How can this one developer control the moderators and users of thousands of subreddits? Could it be that people are choosing to support the Apollo dev, and Reddit has all the power to stop the blackout... by giving the people what they want?
  - dale_glass 3y ago
    Uh, no, he can't. He's a dev of a well liked application. That's all. He's not the head of some sort of shadowy cabal that decides when and how the blackout happens. Certainly, he could send a public message and say "I'm happy now, please stop guys". But it's up to them to listen to that or not.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
  - willis936 3y ago
Marsymars 3y ago
You might claim that’s extortion, but it clearly isn’t blackmail, unless you think he’s got even more dirt on reddit that he hasn’t publicly revealed.
- kats 3y ago
  You're right, it's not the right word.
n42 3y ago
This is business. This is how it works. This a very similar situation as cable providers pulling networks and sending messages to users about how the networks are being unreasonable. The problem is Apollo is tied to one network. Spez calling a kid’s awkward business negotiation a blackmail tactic, and appearing visibly threatened and agitated, immediately removed any credibility or respect I will ever hold for him or the Reddit executive team. His behavior made him look small and weak. I am indifferent about their attempt to monetize, for what it’s worth. It’s inevitable, and third party clients won’t survive. I am more shocked at how it’s being handled.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

by kats 3y ago

ekanes 3y ago

> Same as always: I love building Apollo, and if Reddit is willing to to talk I'm happy to as well. Got a source for that? He's made it clear that it's too late, and this can't be repaired. How can you trust someone that lied to make you look bad, and you have proof?

joshstrange 3y ago
There is no source, it's a combination of a number of things Christian said in the article, a paraphrasing at best, a strawman more likely. From the article it's clear to me that Christian would come back to the table if Reddit lowered the price and/or gave app developers more time but as it stands now they haven't even replied to him in week(s). Hard to do any negotiating when the other side refuses to talk /and/ slanders/lies about you in public.
- ekanes 3y ago
  Hey, sorry. You were right. I didn't read TFA and just jumped into the comments with outdated opinions. I'm a bit surprised that he'd go back to them, honestly. Would much rather he turn his talents and Appolo towards making the Fediverse easier to use.
- kats 3y ago
  Yes there is a source. It's quote from his most recent comment on reddit. https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/147a8xb/as_the_subreddit_blackout_begins_i_wanted_to_say/jnxhov1/?context=3 https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/147a8xb/as_the_s...

leokennis 3y ago

It seems you don’t really see the power dynamics here. Reddit holds all the power: they have the API, they can shut anyone out of it, they can ask for it whatever they want, they could even re-open all closed subreddits and install new mods. All the community and Apollo has is the power to say “Reddit, if you don’t play nice, we’ll walk away”. To call that a blackmail requires some mental gymnastics.

kats 3y ago
Nope, Reddit currently has a bunch of their subreddits private. And if the Apollo dev gets paid, then he can come up with something to make the blackout go away. That's the leverage he has to ask for money. It's what he implied in the call he had recorded, and he keeps indicating he's open to an offer. If reddit goes back to normal before he has an offer then that's when he has no leverage anymore.
- Timon3 3y ago
  > Nope, Reddit currently has a bunch of their subreddits private. And if the Apollo dev gets paid, then he can come up with something to make the blackout go away. Can you explain what that could be? How can this one developer control the moderators and users of thousands of subreddits? Could it be that people are choosing to support the Apollo dev, and Reddit has all the power to stop the blackout... by giving the people what they want?
- dale_glass 3y ago
  Uh, no, he can't. He's a dev of a well liked application. That's all. He's not the head of some sort of shadowy cabal that decides when and how the blackout happens. Certainly, he could send a public message and say "I'm happy now, please stop guys". But it's up to them to listen to that or not.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- willis936 3y ago

Marsymars 3y ago

You might claim that’s extortion, but it clearly isn’t blackmail, unless you think he’s got even more dirt on reddit that he hasn’t publicly revealed.

kats 3y ago
You're right, it's not the right word.

n42 3y ago

This is business. This is how it works. This a very similar situation as cable providers pulling networks and sending messages to users about how the networks are being unreasonable. The problem is Apollo is tied to one network. Spez calling a kid’s awkward business negotiation a blackmail tactic, and appearing visibly threatened and agitated, immediately removed any credibility or respect I will ever hold for him or the Reddit executive team. His behavior made him look small and weak. I am indifferent about their attempt to monetize, for what it’s worth. It’s inevitable, and third party clients won’t survive. I am more shocked at how it’s being handled.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]