4 ms·

> If Air India wants to risk sanctions, whereby their entire fleet loses access to new planes, engines, parts and servicing, sure. I highly doubt that because

> If Air India wants to risk sanctions, whereby their entire fleet loses access to new planes, engines, parts and servicing, sure. I highly doubt that because these kind of sanctions given with absolute bullshit reason would really hurt west's claim of being better. Even the Russia's sanctions is going really badly for Europe and west is not in a good time to extend their arms further. Also China is developing its own airplane and now is definitely not a great time to encourage other countries which don't have good relation with west.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> these kind of sanctions given with absolute bullshit reason would really hurt west's claim of being better Point is if Air India strolled into Russia with restricted engine components, there would be consequences. Everyone at GE involved would be subject to criminal investigation. Everyone's banking relationships would be in jeopardy. Sanctions indirectly enforce themselves. Air India could get a waiver, but that takes time, time during which that plane would be stranded and unproductive. Those were the stakes here. Because nobody is stupid enough to stick their finger to U.S. sanctions and rely on the “West’s claim of being better.”
- kaliqt 3y ago
  Just gotta love politics making everyone's life more difficult.
  - j16sdiz 3y ago
    sure full scale thermal nuclear war is better than politics.
- YetAnotherNick 3y ago
  West is all about PR and jeopardizing 100s of billions of dollars of trade for few equipments that Air India shifted from India to Russia to help a stranded airplane is the worst possible thing any politician could do. And what has it to do with GE? The equipment belongs to Air India in India. And just if you don't know, India is not part of US Russia sanctions and trades with both.
  - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
    > West is all about PR and jeopardizing 100s of billions of dollars of trade for few equipments that Air India shifted from India to Russia to help a stranded airplane is the worst possible thing any politician could do It's not a political decision. It's current law. What Air India would have needed would have been a political decision, a waiver, to an understandable but unforeseen situation. New Delhi would be fine asking for forgiveness if this were military plane. But Air India, a private company, has to deal with other private companies. Do you think Air India's banks want to bet their livelihoods on an ex post facto waiver? Even if (read: when) Air India is given a waiver, the American wire officer who processed their transactions after a known sanctions violation would be in personal jeopardy, legally, professionally and possibly criminally. Same for every engineer who provided support, every courier who knowingly transported parts. > what has it to do with GE? The equipment belongs to Air India in India. The engine on that 777 is made by GE. It has to comply with U.S. law. You don't want every part and service contract with GE and Boeing and who knows who else being held up while you get forgiveness.
    - YetAnotherNick 3y ago
      There is no "law" for this. Stop making things up. Just because GE made the engine doesn't mean that their customers are bound to US policies. Sure, GE could stop selling the engine in the future but the engine that has been sold is Air India's property not GE. Indian policy is to do trade with Russia and that is all that matters here.
      - qwytw 3y ago
        > ure, GE could stop selling the engine in the future but the engine that has been sold is Air India's property not G You do realize engines like this require continuous maintenance, access to parts etc? They couldn't safely operate their fleet for very long without western companies. Risking all of that just so that they wouldn't have to delay the repairs for a few weeks or even months would make zero sense. > Indian policy is to do trade with Russia and that is all that matters here. Air India operates zero Russian airplanes and it's fleet is exclusively made up from Airbus and Boeing jets. There are zero practical reasons for them to want to move away from that now.
varispeed 3y ago
That's some mental gymnastics here, comrade. Yes, punishment of countries that support Russian terrorism IS better.
- YetAnotherNick 3y ago
  Maybe start with punishing Europe then where the trade increased after the war: https://tradingeconomics.com/european-union/imports/russia https://tradingeconomics.com/european-union/imports/russia. India and China haven't even agreed to sanction ever.
  - qwytw 3y ago
    > Maybe start with punishing Europe then where the trade increased after the war Importing the same amount or even much lower amounts of oil/gas at much higher prices would result in higher overall imports yes. Also Russian a lot natural resource exports were/are exempt from sanctions due to practical reasons so what are you trying to say? > India and China haven't even agreed to sanction ever. Yet their companies will at least more or less outwardly comply with them because they want to continue doing business with western companies. It makes zero sense for Air India to ship GE engines to Russia without getting an exemption. All of that is completely irrelevant of course since the airplane in question is already back in India...

JumpCrisscross 3y ago

> these kind of sanctions given with absolute bullshit reason would really hurt west's claim of being better Point is if Air India strolled into Russia with restricted engine components, there would be consequences. Everyone at GE involved would be subject to criminal investigation. Everyone's banking relationships would be in jeopardy. Sanctions indirectly enforce themselves. Air India could get a waiver, but that takes time, time during which that plane would be stranded and unproductive. Those were the stakes here. Because nobody is stupid enough to stick their finger to U.S. sanctions and rely on the “West’s claim of being better.”

kaliqt 3y ago
Just gotta love politics making everyone's life more difficult.
- j16sdiz 3y ago
  sure full scale thermal nuclear war is better than politics.
YetAnotherNick 3y ago
West is all about PR and jeopardizing 100s of billions of dollars of trade for few equipments that Air India shifted from India to Russia to help a stranded airplane is the worst possible thing any politician could do. And what has it to do with GE? The equipment belongs to Air India in India. And just if you don't know, India is not part of US Russia sanctions and trades with both.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  > West is all about PR and jeopardizing 100s of billions of dollars of trade for few equipments that Air India shifted from India to Russia to help a stranded airplane is the worst possible thing any politician could do It's not a political decision. It's current law. What Air India would have needed would have been a political decision, a waiver, to an understandable but unforeseen situation. New Delhi would be fine asking for forgiveness if this were military plane. But Air India, a private company, has to deal with other private companies. Do you think Air India's banks want to bet their livelihoods on an ex post facto waiver? Even if (read: when) Air India is given a waiver, the American wire officer who processed their transactions after a known sanctions violation would be in personal jeopardy, legally, professionally and possibly criminally. Same for every engineer who provided support, every courier who knowingly transported parts. > what has it to do with GE? The equipment belongs to Air India in India. The engine on that 777 is made by GE. It has to comply with U.S. law. You don't want every part and service contract with GE and Boeing and who knows who else being held up while you get forgiveness.
  - YetAnotherNick 3y ago
    There is no "law" for this. Stop making things up. Just because GE made the engine doesn't mean that their customers are bound to US policies. Sure, GE could stop selling the engine in the future but the engine that has been sold is Air India's property not GE. Indian policy is to do trade with Russia and that is all that matters here.
    - qwytw 3y ago
      > ure, GE could stop selling the engine in the future but the engine that has been sold is Air India's property not G You do realize engines like this require continuous maintenance, access to parts etc? They couldn't safely operate their fleet for very long without western companies. Risking all of that just so that they wouldn't have to delay the repairs for a few weeks or even months would make zero sense. > Indian policy is to do trade with Russia and that is all that matters here. Air India operates zero Russian airplanes and it's fleet is exclusively made up from Airbus and Boeing jets. There are zero practical reasons for them to want to move away from that now.

varispeed 3y ago

That's some mental gymnastics here, comrade. Yes, punishment of countries that support Russian terrorism IS better.

YetAnotherNick 3y ago
Maybe start with punishing Europe then where the trade increased after the war: https://tradingeconomics.com/european-union/imports/russia https://tradingeconomics.com/european-union/imports/russia. India and China haven't even agreed to sanction ever.
- qwytw 3y ago
  > Maybe start with punishing Europe then where the trade increased after the war Importing the same amount or even much lower amounts of oil/gas at much higher prices would result in higher overall imports yes. Also Russian a lot natural resource exports were/are exempt from sanctions due to practical reasons so what are you trying to say? > India and China haven't even agreed to sanction ever. Yet their companies will at least more or less outwardly comply with them because they want to continue doing business with western companies. It makes zero sense for Air India to ship GE engines to Russia without getting an exemption. All of that is completely irrelevant of course since the airplane in question is already back in India...