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I rabbit-holed to the 2005 "irate call" from Steve Jobs: https://www.techemails.com/p/sergey-brin-irate-call-from-steve-jobs https://www.techemails.com/p/sergey

I rabbit-holed to the 2005 "irate call" from Steve Jobs: https://www.techemails.com/p/sergey-brin-irate-call-from-steve-jobs https://www.techemails.com/p/sergey-brin-irate-call-from-ste... Does anyone know who was the REDACTED browser expert being recruited by Google?

musicale 3y ago
So many interesting things there. Jobs and Campbell knew each other from Apple antiquity, and both Campbell and Eric Schmidt sat on Apple's board - and Jobs was already ballistic about Android vs. iPhone. On one hand I understand how Jobs would have been angry about Google trying to poach the Safari team for Chrome, but on the other I completely agree that anti-poaching schemes (as well as non-compete clauses) are harmful to employees and illegal for good reason. One fair solution for employees would presumably have been to deal with it head on and make competing offers up to the level of the Safari team's actual value to Apple, but companies are rarely enthusiastic about that as it costs them money and encourages other employees to ask for raises and/or to interview at other companies (probably to discover that they are underpaid.) An interesting possibility would have been for Apple and Google (or Google and Mozilla for that matter) to collaborate more closely on web browsers, although that would have run into problems eventually due to business incentives. Sadly one of the primary results from Chrome seems to have been the erosion of Firefox's browser share.
- B1FF_PSUVM 3y ago
  > Jobs was already ballistic about Android vs. iPhone. This was 2005, well before that, which is part of what makes it interesting. I think this was about the time that Apple picked up the KDE Konqueror browser Webkit platform and reworked it. I seem to recall there being some objections to Apple fulfilling its open-source obligations by tossing a massive patch "over the wall" ... P.S. quick search result, 2003: https://dot.kde.org/2003/01/08/apple-announces-new-safari-browser https://dot.kde.org/2003/01/08/apple-announces-new-safari-br...
  - musicale 3y ago
    Good catch - should be "subsequently" rather than "already" since this was 2005 and the iPhone didn't come out until 2007. I can imagine Jobs being upset initially by Google trying to poach the Safari team and subsequently even more upset by Android's iPhone-like UI redesign – especially given the presence of Google execs on Apple's board.
- saagarjha 3y ago
  > One fair solution for employees would presumably have been to deal with it head on and make competing offers up to the level of the Safari team's actual value to Apple Money does not solve all problems. Sometimes people leave companies and there is no dollar value that will get them to come back.
  - musicale 3y ago
    I don't think that makes it less important to make fair offers.
cdibona 3y ago
Yea, but,not gonna share. What I told Sergey was to tell Steve 'you can't take a person away from a job they love'
- i386 3y ago
  I’m betting it was none only but Ben Goodger. There’s no way you guys would have been coping that hard about it otherwise.
  - Huggernaut 3y ago
    Article says the referral of [REDACTED] was made by Ben Goodger.
    - i386 3y ago
      Ahh

musicale 3y ago

So many interesting things there. Jobs and Campbell knew each other from Apple antiquity, and both Campbell and Eric Schmidt sat on Apple's board - and Jobs was already ballistic about Android vs. iPhone. On one hand I understand how Jobs would have been angry about Google trying to poach the Safari team for Chrome, but on the other I completely agree that anti-poaching schemes (as well as non-compete clauses) are harmful to employees and illegal for good reason. One fair solution for employees would presumably have been to deal with it head on and make competing offers up to the level of the Safari team's actual value to Apple, but companies are rarely enthusiastic about that as it costs them money and encourages other employees to ask for raises and/or to interview at other companies (probably to discover that they are underpaid.) An interesting possibility would have been for Apple and Google (or Google and Mozilla for that matter) to collaborate more closely on web browsers, although that would have run into problems eventually due to business incentives. Sadly one of the primary results from Chrome seems to have been the erosion of Firefox's browser share.

B1FF_PSUVM 3y ago
> Jobs was already ballistic about Android vs. iPhone. This was 2005, well before that, which is part of what makes it interesting. I think this was about the time that Apple picked up the KDE Konqueror browser Webkit platform and reworked it. I seem to recall there being some objections to Apple fulfilling its open-source obligations by tossing a massive patch "over the wall" ... P.S. quick search result, 2003: https://dot.kde.org/2003/01/08/apple-announces-new-safari-browser https://dot.kde.org/2003/01/08/apple-announces-new-safari-br...
- musicale 3y ago
  Good catch - should be "subsequently" rather than "already" since this was 2005 and the iPhone didn't come out until 2007. I can imagine Jobs being upset initially by Google trying to poach the Safari team and subsequently even more upset by Android's iPhone-like UI redesign – especially given the presence of Google execs on Apple's board.
saagarjha 3y ago
> One fair solution for employees would presumably have been to deal with it head on and make competing offers up to the level of the Safari team's actual value to Apple Money does not solve all problems. Sometimes people leave companies and there is no dollar value that will get them to come back.
- musicale 3y ago
  I don't think that makes it less important to make fair offers.

cdibona 3y ago

Yea, but,not gonna share. What I told Sergey was to tell Steve 'you can't take a person away from a job they love'

i386 3y ago
I’m betting it was none only but Ben Goodger. There’s no way you guys would have been coping that hard about it otherwise.
- Huggernaut 3y ago
  Article says the referral of [REDACTED] was made by Ben Goodger.
  - i386 3y ago
    Ahh