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What really happened, as stated in the very source you gave, was that if you had a heart attack at home an ambulance would come to “deal with you” (because of c

by jakear 3y ago

What really happened, as stated in the very source you gave, was that if you had a heart attack at home an ambulance would come to “deal with you” (because of course they would), but if they attempted to resuscitate you for 20 minutes and you still didn’t recover they wouldn’t then take you to the hospital. You should know the survival rate of a heart attack is far far lower than most expect, especially after 20 minutes of failed active attempts to resuscitate. The only real reason to take someone into a hospital after that is if they’re hypothermic or just so you can say “we did everything we could”. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-cpr-expectations-idUSKCN1G72SW https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-cpr-expectations-i...

andsoitis 3y ago
> What really happened.... an ambulance would come to “deal with you” At one point, LA had to resort to Fire Trucks because ambulances were unavailable. If you don't think health care services were severely stretched, in some cases beyond breaking point (incl. staff unavailability because they themselves were sick), I really don't know what to say. This happened in New York as well. Of course there are also other places where that wasn’t the case, so there you could be less conservative with restrictions, but you may not know the risk in advance.
- jakear 3y ago
  Fire trucks and ambulances both feature staff trained as EMT’s. The provisioning of the vehicles might be slightly different, but the medical training is the same. And I’m sure the provisioning could be adjusted based on the circumstances. Staff being unavailable because they’re sick is quite literally “normal day to day operations” that every company must be able to account for, not “beyond the breaking point”. But if you “don’t know what to say” beyond vague emotional appeals unsupported by the very sources you claim to cite, I’m glad we agree on that at least.
fzeroracer 3y ago
There are many [1] many [2] many [3] many [4] many [5] many [6] many [7] examples of people who died as a result of our hospital systems being overloaded and being forced to ration care. This is what was meant by the geometric growth of hospital patients and how many hospital systems were close to outright breaking. You are ultimately factually wrong and extremely unaware of how much stress this put on our hospital systems and how many people died because of what you were suggesting. Now imagine how much worse it would've been if we did nothing. [1] https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/09/13/1036593269/coronavirus-alabama-43-icus-at-capacity-ray-demonia https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/0... [2] https://www.politico.com/news/agenda/2021/10/26/lack-hospital-space-crisis-covid-517219 https://www.politico.com/news/agenda/2021/10/26/lack-hospita... [3] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-us-hospital-icu-bed-shortage-veteran-dies-treatable-illness/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-us-hospital-icu-bed-short... [4] https://www.whsv.com/2021/08/27/man-dies-waiting-icu-bed-family-says/ https://www.whsv.com/2021/08/27/man-dies-waiting-icu-bed-fam... [5] https://www.businessinsider.com/man-covid-dead-doctors-icu-bed-oklahoma-2021-10 https://www.businessinsider.com/man-covid-dead-doctors-icu-b... [6] https://www.ketv.com/article/auburn-man-dies-in-des-moines-hospital-after-staff-cant-find-icu-room-in-nebraska/37467453 https://www.ketv.com/article/auburn-man-dies-in-des-moines-h... [7] https://www.newsweek.com/kansas-man-dies-after-waiting-icu-bed-hospitals-filled-covid-19-patients-1623922 https://www.newsweek.com/kansas-man-dies-after-waiting-icu-b...
- jakear 3y ago
  7 whole examples? Wow. And how many millions of children have ongoing severely stunted development in both academics and social skills? More than 7 million. By some estimates 77 million, in fact. The real question is how many more will die as a result of our horribly irresponsible treatment of our most valuable national resource: the children.

by jakear 3y ago

andsoitis 3y ago

> What really happened.... an ambulance would come to “deal with you” At one point, LA had to resort to Fire Trucks because ambulances were unavailable. If you don't think health care services were severely stretched, in some cases beyond breaking point (incl. staff unavailability because they themselves were sick), I really don't know what to say. This happened in New York as well. Of course there are also other places where that wasn’t the case, so there you could be less conservative with restrictions, but you may not know the risk in advance.

jakear 3y ago
Fire trucks and ambulances both feature staff trained as EMT’s. The provisioning of the vehicles might be slightly different, but the medical training is the same. And I’m sure the provisioning could be adjusted based on the circumstances. Staff being unavailable because they’re sick is quite literally “normal day to day operations” that every company must be able to account for, not “beyond the breaking point”. But if you “don’t know what to say” beyond vague emotional appeals unsupported by the very sources you claim to cite, I’m glad we agree on that at least.

fzeroracer 3y ago

There are many [1] many [2] many [3] many [4] many [5] many [6] many [7] examples of people who died as a result of our hospital systems being overloaded and being forced to ration care. This is what was meant by the geometric growth of hospital patients and how many hospital systems were close to outright breaking. You are ultimately factually wrong and extremely unaware of how much stress this put on our hospital systems and how many people died because of what you were suggesting. Now imagine how much worse it would've been if we did nothing. [1] https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/09/13/1036593269/coronavirus-alabama-43-icus-at-capacity-ray-demonia https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/0... [2] https://www.politico.com/news/agenda/2021/10/26/lack-hospital-space-crisis-covid-517219 https://www.politico.com/news/agenda/2021/10/26/lack-hospita... [3] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-us-hospital-icu-bed-shortage-veteran-dies-treatable-illness/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-us-hospital-icu-bed-short... [4] https://www.whsv.com/2021/08/27/man-dies-waiting-icu-bed-family-says/ https://www.whsv.com/2021/08/27/man-dies-waiting-icu-bed-fam... [5] https://www.businessinsider.com/man-covid-dead-doctors-icu-bed-oklahoma-2021-10 https://www.businessinsider.com/man-covid-dead-doctors-icu-b... [6] https://www.ketv.com/article/auburn-man-dies-in-des-moines-hospital-after-staff-cant-find-icu-room-in-nebraska/37467453 https://www.ketv.com/article/auburn-man-dies-in-des-moines-h... [7] https://www.newsweek.com/kansas-man-dies-after-waiting-icu-bed-hospitals-filled-covid-19-patients-1623922 https://www.newsweek.com/kansas-man-dies-after-waiting-icu-b...

jakear 3y ago
7 whole examples? Wow. And how many millions of children have ongoing severely stunted development in both academics and social skills? More than 7 million. By some estimates 77 million, in fact. The real question is how many more will die as a result of our horribly irresponsible treatment of our most valuable national resource: the children.