7 ms·

Why is Elm getting forked?

aurelius83 3y ago
I mean the last commit for Elm core was in 2021. Changes require sign off that doesn’t seem likely from who is currently maintaining it. Why not fork it if you are interested in evolving ELM?
- vbezhenar 3y ago
  So elm is abandoned or there's more to this story?
  - lolinder 3y ago
    You'll see people arguing that it's not, but I'll let you be the judge. https://elm-lang.org/news https://elm-lang.org/news https://github.com/elm/compiler/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/compiler/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/core/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/core/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/compiler/commits/master https://github.com/elm/compiler/commits/master https://github.com/elm/core/commits/master https://github.com/elm/core/commits/master
    - G4BB3R 3y ago
      Also: https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend https://elm.studio https://elm.studio https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming-languages.html https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming...
  - m8s 3y ago
    There's more to the story in that Elm is a stable, high-quality frontend language that works as well as its creator wants it to for now. There are a lot of happy Elm users over on the Elm Slack, and it's being used in production at various companies. There's also [Elm on the Backend](https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend), a recent talk given by the creator of Elm, about his experiments in using Elm as a full-stack language. There are some notes and a few photos, but no video as far as I'm aware. I'm not involved in the Elm community nor do I write it for a living though, so I'm only kind of aware of what's going on over in the Elm world.
    - Cupprum 3y ago
      I saw the Elm on the Backend presentation. Evan would like ELM to be a full stack language. If it will work properly, you will not have to manage the message passing (JSON, XML). Seems like very interesting topic. Evan looked really psyched about.
    - brabel 3y ago
      From elm.studio: "We are bringing the simplicity and friendliness of Elm to hosting. No configuration. Just press publish." And from the About Page on elm.studio: "The ultimate goal is to produce a fun and simple programming language, with the kind support and camaraderie of people who like what we do and how we do it." Very little information about what is the next step in Elm's life, or even whether they've actually left it... I guess the upcoming talk on StrangeLoop[1] may clear things up... his description on that talk hints at what he's up to: "He lives in Denmark, working alongside his wife at elm.studio to keep Elm independent and interesting." Elm may still be alive, just not publically for now. EDIT: just found this while looking for more information: https://iselmdead.info/ https://iselmdead.info/ :D [1] https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming-languages.html https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming...
      - oxnrtr 3y ago
        > Why is it a good thing that Elm doesn’t get frequent updates? First of all, it means your code will last a long time! It also means the language is very stable, because features are carefully thought out before being implemented. What an absolute clown car.
        tasuki 3y ago
        Actually I think that's a reasonable stance. Not everyone wants to use the newest and greatest JavaScript framework which is will be completely reworked in six months because there's a need for a newer and greatester version. The speed of evolution of JavaScript frameworks is amazing, yet they're all still worse thought out than Elm.
        3y ago
  - vosper 3y ago
    It’s abandoned
- ecshafer 3y ago
  huh interesting. I played with elm a while back, and thought it was cool. I haven't kept up in its development though. Sad it got abandoned.
- canadianfella 3y ago
  [dead]
hu3 3y ago
For one, it's been over 2 years without an Elm release. And there are many open bugs untracked in GitHub. https://github.com/elm/compiler/issues https://github.com/elm/compiler/issues Unrelated to your question but for those curious, here's a comparison between Gren and Elm : https://gren-lang.org/book/faq.html#what-are-the-differences-between-gren-and-elm https://gren-lang.org/book/faq.html#what-are-the-differences...
- Kiro 3y ago
  > No GLSL syntax. What does this mean? I know what GLSL is but I don't understand what Elm or Gren have to do with it.
  - piaste 3y ago
    Elm has a special syntax construct (similar to a Haskell quasiquote) to embed GLSL code into Elm files, and typechecking it as well. I imagins this is useful when writing shaders for WebGL apps that are written in Elm. I don't know why Gren removed them, though.
- arp242 3y ago
  One boring and banal problem I ran in to was that it will output text in yellow and some other colours which are hard to read on my white terminal background, and this is hard-coded and you can't disable colours (doesn't even disable with isatty). IIRC Evan didn't really want to fix it because "just use a dark background then". This is basically why I never used elm: because the compiler is hard to use as I struggle reading its output. (Before anyone comments "why don't you change yellow in your terminal": then this will break applications such as pamix which hard-code to a black background and use yellow text on that, or applications which have a black statusbar or the like with yellow text on it – it's not so easy to choose colours that work in all scenarios and all things considered sticking to the default set is the "least broken" since almost everything has an option to just disable colours).
  - Skinney 3y ago
    Would you mind creating a github issue for it? I’ll try to get it fixed for the december release (0.3 is releasing next week, which doesn’t leave me with enough time to do it now).

I mean the last commit for Elm core was in 2021. Changes require sign off that doesn’t seem likely from who is currently maintaining it. Why not fork it if you are interested in evolving ELM?

vbezhenar 3y ago
So elm is abandoned or there's more to this story?
- lolinder 3y ago
  You'll see people arguing that it's not, but I'll let you be the judge. https://elm-lang.org/news https://elm-lang.org/news https://github.com/elm/compiler/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/compiler/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/core/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/core/pulse/monthly https://github.com/elm/compiler/commits/master https://github.com/elm/compiler/commits/master https://github.com/elm/core/commits/master https://github.com/elm/core/commits/master
  - G4BB3R 3y ago
    Also: https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend https://elm.studio https://elm.studio https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming-languages.html https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming...
- m8s 3y ago
  There's more to the story in that Elm is a stable, high-quality frontend language that works as well as its creator wants it to for now. There are a lot of happy Elm users over on the Elm Slack, and it's being used in production at various companies. There's also [Elm on the Backend](https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend), a recent talk given by the creator of Elm, about his experiments in using Elm as a full-stack language. There are some notes and a few photos, but no video as far as I'm aware. I'm not involved in the Elm community nor do I write it for a living though, so I'm only kind of aware of what's going on over in the Elm world.
  - Cupprum 3y ago
    I saw the Elm on the Backend presentation. Evan would like ELM to be a full stack language. If it will work properly, you will not have to manage the message passing (JSON, XML). Seems like very interesting topic. Evan looked really psyched about.
  - brabel 3y ago
    From elm.studio: "We are bringing the simplicity and friendliness of Elm to hosting. No configuration. Just press publish." And from the About Page on elm.studio: "The ultimate goal is to produce a fun and simple programming language, with the kind support and camaraderie of people who like what we do and how we do it." Very little information about what is the next step in Elm's life, or even whether they've actually left it... I guess the upcoming talk on StrangeLoop[1] may clear things up... his description on that talk hints at what he's up to: "He lives in Denmark, working alongside his wife at elm.studio to keep Elm independent and interesting." Elm may still be alive, just not publically for now. EDIT: just found this while looking for more information: https://iselmdead.info/ https://iselmdead.info/ :D [1] https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming-languages.html https://thestrangeloop.com/2023/the-economics-of-programming...
    - oxnrtr 3y ago
      > Why is it a good thing that Elm doesn’t get frequent updates? First of all, it means your code will last a long time! It also means the language is very stable, because features are carefully thought out before being implemented. What an absolute clown car.
      - tasuki 3y ago
        Actually I think that's a reasonable stance. Not everyone wants to use the newest and greatest JavaScript framework which is will be completely reworked in six months because there's a need for a newer and greatester version. The speed of evolution of JavaScript frameworks is amazing, yet they're all still worse thought out than Elm.
      - 3y ago
- vosper 3y ago
  It’s abandoned
ecshafer 3y ago
huh interesting. I played with elm a while back, and thought it was cool. I haven't kept up in its development though. Sad it got abandoned.
canadianfella 3y ago
[dead]

hu3 3y ago

For one, it's been over 2 years without an Elm release. And there are many open bugs untracked in GitHub. https://github.com/elm/compiler/issues https://github.com/elm/compiler/issues Unrelated to your question but for those curious, here's a comparison between Gren and Elm : https://gren-lang.org/book/faq.html#what-are-the-differences-between-gren-and-elm https://gren-lang.org/book/faq.html#what-are-the-differences...

Kiro 3y ago
> No GLSL syntax. What does this mean? I know what GLSL is but I don't understand what Elm or Gren have to do with it.
- piaste 3y ago
  Elm has a special syntax construct (similar to a Haskell quasiquote) to embed GLSL code into Elm files, and typechecking it as well. I imagins this is useful when writing shaders for WebGL apps that are written in Elm. I don't know why Gren removed them, though.
arp242 3y ago
One boring and banal problem I ran in to was that it will output text in yellow and some other colours which are hard to read on my white terminal background, and this is hard-coded and you can't disable colours (doesn't even disable with isatty). IIRC Evan didn't really want to fix it because "just use a dark background then". This is basically why I never used elm: because the compiler is hard to use as I struggle reading its output. (Before anyone comments "why don't you change yellow in your terminal": then this will break applications such as pamix which hard-code to a black background and use yellow text on that, or applications which have a black statusbar or the like with yellow text on it – it's not so easy to choose colours that work in all scenarios and all things considered sticking to the default set is the "least broken" since almost everything has an option to just disable colours).
- Skinney 3y ago
  Would you mind creating a github issue for it? I’ll try to get it fixed for the december release (0.3 is releasing next week, which doesn’t leave me with enough time to do it now).